Future Fighters ?

Canada is broke. They won't be buying much of anything.

I was mentioning them as they've flip flopped over this I wasn't sure if they were on or not.

As for "broke" ... isn't everyone ? And we are getting some subs ... sometime (not that I think it's a good idea, with our limited budget).

While the F35 certainly has its issues, it is here and it is functional, and is still one of if not the most technologically advanced aircraft made. And with no 6th gen fighter in the works yet (that we know of) who knows when we even would see one. Holding out for one would seem to be quite the risk. And I can't imagine EU countries buying from China or Russia so I'm not even sure what an alternative would be.

Picking up a used F15 or F16 would put them ahead of 95% of the world, but would be cannon fodder against any of the big 3 militaries.

Looks like France is working with Germany on their "6th gen" for release in 2030, but I would doubt anything they could come up competing with whatever China has to offer, or even the F35 even if it is technically a generation behind.

Also depends what your goals are. F22 is still the king in direct air-to-air combat (although not for sale), but from what I've heard the F35 would be able to take out an F22 at long range before the F22 can even see it, due to its stealth systems and long range missiles.

My feeling this that you need a small fleet of stealthy attack aircraft (F22, F117?) to take out the air defense radars then hit everything with less stealthy aircraft (F18, F15, ...).
Obviously this is easier to do in Iraq than in Russia (or China or US). Obviously against a tier 1 attack you need Tier 1 defense (ie China or US will be able to field a larger fleet of more up to date (and stealthy) aircraft than say UK or Australia or Canada).

My proposition was than given the unpredictability of the US, can countries rely on US military ? Particularly with modern complex aircraft, maybe there is a "kill switch" (or an MCAS ??) that needs update information from the US (that can be turned off) ??

And further, given previous history, if countries start developing other vehicles in opposition to US derived vehicles, the US can be (has been) very predatory.

lucky-guesser said:

And with no 6th gen fighter in the works yet

Click to expand...

ah, see NGAD program.

SWComposites said:

ah, see NGAD program.

Click to expand...

"As reported by Breaking Defense,[26] In July 2024, Secretary of the Air Force Frank Kendall announced that the Air Force was "taking a pause" on the crewed component of the NGAD program. “With the platform itself, we’re taking a pause. With the rest of the elements of the air dominance family of systems, we’re moving forward as fast as we can.”

Yes, the program exists and is doing research, but at least from what I have read there isn't enough funding / desire to where they are actually working on the next F-xyz air craft. Individual technologies are being worked on but it sounds like it will be a while before that tech is actually consolidated into a new air platform.

NGAD prototypes have already flown.

So Canada is reviewing (again) the F35 purchase. It'd be a PITA to operate two types (maybe 16 F35s and 70? other) ... if we're smart we'd get the 16 we're committed to as someone else's fit out (and resell to them, to save operating them). "other" would've been F18 (as we operate them already) but not now .. now Eurofighter, Griffen, or maybe Rafale. US will have a hissy fit, but they brought it on themselves.

Go Portugal ! their individual order may be small, but I think the signal is what's important.

Welcome to the new world order.

I guess this makes Dassault the premier fighter builder in Europe they will / are laughing all the way to the bank, I guess they will take lead on Europes 6th gen unless we see something like a radical UAV fighter come out of Ukraine that forms the basis for a rapid 6th gen.

For those countrys pondering their buys of F-35's I would suggest they are considering two new aspects the political willingness to support them when required and whether the USA can maintain the program given the political changes are likely to cause large contractions in the USA economy that will not be reversible inside of 20 plus years.

Unmanned [optionally manned?] Fighter drones are coming.

Current planning would place a manned fighter at the core of a 'team' of IA driven unmanned air-to-air, ground attack, SAM suppression, deep interdiction, etc drones. The majority would be considered force-multipliers for continuous high threat combat... some would be defined as 'kamikaze' [expendable] fighters.

U.S. Air Force, Navy Brief Trump On Future Fighter Plans​

U.S. Air Force, Navy Brief Trump On Future Fighter Plans | Aviation Week Network

USAF and Navy leaders have pitched their future fighter plans to Trump, as the Pentagon and the administration prepare to decide how to fund procurement.

aviationweek.com

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Podcast: NGAD Is Up, NGAS Is Down & CCAs Are Inbound​

Podcast: NGAD Is Up, NGAS Is Down & CCAs Are Inbound | Aviation Week Network

What's the latest on plans for next-generation U.S. Air Force platforms in the age of DOGE? Editors share what they've been hearing.

aviationweek.com

yes, but will foreign governments be as willing to commit to US projects in future (as they were in the past) given the recent demonstration of volatility of the leadership of the US (or indeed any country) ?

Trump announces Boeing wins contract for next-generation fighter jet... F-47??? Say-What????


This is likely unmanned...