(3)-11 7/8 LVL to steel beam connection? 2

[COEngineeer]

What is the best way to connect (3)-1 3/4x11 7/8 LVL to W10 beam? Let's say the connection need to support 4kips. I cant really use top flange simpson hanger on 2x nailer because thats too weak. Do I have to use face mount hanger on web pack? how do I secure the web pack and how long?

 

[UcfSE]

I have the C-2006 Simpson catalog and on pages 100 and 101 I see top-flange hangers that go over 6300 pounds. These have the option of being welded directly to the steel instead of using a nailer. Do those not work for you?

 

[COEngineeer]

But then I need 10 3/8" hanger to make the top justified with the 2x nailer.

 

[UcfSE]

Why not go to a W12 to match the LVL dimension?

 

[COEngineeer]

Cause I need a 2x nailer to nail all the I joists. Shall I start using web packed W12 instead and use face mount?
Is that what you do on your projects ucfse?

 

[UcfSE]

If you use a face mount and use wood blocking out to the edge of the web, you'll be loading your wide flange with torsion. That'll probably kill it and you'll need a much larger beam. Then again, that's the same as using a hanger weled to the edge of the flange.

I don't do a lot of wood framing myself. These are things I would try first. You can create a hanger or bucket out of steel plate and make whatever you want. That's the nice thing about steel: welding.

 

[COEngineeer]

Yeah, I think that what I will do. I am just frustrated how you can connect (3)-LVL so easily to wood but not to steel.

 

[COEngineeer]

Another question UcfSe, if the design load is not really a factor, which option is better/cheaper for residential do you think? 2 Angles Bolted to the W10 web, 2 Angles welded (shop/field) to the web.

 

[UcfSE]

It's hard to say. I think a residential contractor would not want to deal with welding, but then a field-welded connection will offer more in terms of adjustability for error. Drilling the beam in the field for bolt holes would be difficult and shop drilling could cause a problem if something is installed out of alignment. If you can and the time is in your budget, I would put some options on there for the connection and let the contractor choose. Being conservative with the connection is probably a good choice as well.

 

[jhoulette]

I find most residential buildings want nothing to do with welding in the field. Too much trouble to get a welder out there at that time during construction. The project could be delayed for that. Usually they request a web pack. In your case I would go with the W10 shape (the W12 may be too deep for the 11 7/8") and they want something to nail the floor sheathing to. The detail I use is web packing of about 2ft with 2 thru bolts each end.

 

[COEngineeer]

Is it easy to drill holes for the bolts in the field? Do you use the bolts just to secure the web packing and let it bear on the bottom flange, or do you design the bolts to take all the weight?

 

[dik]

Can you use an 1/8 strap welded to the beam top flange wrapping around the bot of the wood beam? Drill a couple of 3/16 in holes for some 3-1/2" nails... easy to connect for 4K...

Dik

 

[COEngineeer]

Coiled strap? I dont know if i feel comfortable with that. I also got this idea to use 9 1/2 top flange hanger welded to the steel beam and then notch the bottom of (3)-1 1/2x11 7/8 LVL about 7/8". This will meet NDS req. for notching the tension side.

 

[rday]

COEngineer

As far as notching, look at the manufacturer's specs. For instance TrusJoist does not allow rectangular holes (notches) in thier LVL product. You don't want to leave the owner with a product the manufacturer will not warranty.

I think the packed web is the most likely solution since you have a flush condition. It can be designed to allow for some field adjustment, by doing a longer packed section. I design the bolts to transfer the load to the web.

 

[dik]

Not coiled strap, but bar material... can increase the thickness a tad to 3/16 if needed, but 4k is not a large load. Width is dependent on compression loading. Bend the strap to fit the bottom of the LVL's (not a 90deg bend) and then twist it to match the steel beam and weld. Check with Simpson or whatever regarding welding of normal top mount hangers... can be done. Check with Cold Formed Steel code for welding... Hangers are often fabricated from HDG sheets and a bit of caution about welding (fumes and spatter).

Dik

 

[KeySol]

I am not sure if Im late with a solution but I will throw it out there anyways.

You should call Simson and ask them. The situation you have is one I have faced many times and Simpson will custom make a hanger that you could weld to the top to the W10.