Adding stories on top of old buildings 3

[Robbiee]

Hi all,
We are getting requests from developers to add 2 or 3 stories to existing old brick buildings. I tell them: this means the existing building will now need to meet the current code, which is challenging, specially for seismic loads, and therefore, we need to provide new lateral resisting system/s that will reinforce the existing building and support the new addition.
I was thinking of using new elevator and stairs shafts in combination with steel moment frames and tie the existing walls to these shafts and frames.
Any comments will be helpful. Thanks

 

[NorthCivil]

Your local governing body should provide specifics on what is required seismically. Base building, yes, will need to be upgraded I imagine, but what about non structural elements? cladding, mechanical units, fixtures, electrical etc.

don't neglect foundations - old foundations may need repair, enlargement, underpinned footings etc. especially around new point loads.

 

[TLHS]

Depending on where you are, an unreinforced brick building may basically need to have a new building built inside it and the bricks tied back to the building if you wanted to bring it up to modern seismic codes, which is probably completely infeasible. I agree that you need to check with your local jurisdiction, but I'd be shocked if there's anywhere that wouldn't make you get to at least a large fraction of current code if you're adding stories.

 

[MotorCity]

Take a look at the International Existing Building Code (IEBC). It will spell out exactly what needs to be reviewed and/or upgraded. There are several methods, exemptions, and requirements....some of which may not be as bad as you think.

 

[Robbiee]

Thank you all for your comments. I should have mentioned that I am in Ontario, Canada.
TLHS, building a new building inside the existing one is what I also thought I needed to do and that is why I said to add new stairs, elevator shafts and steel frame.

 

[CELinOttawa]

I have successfully added four storeys to an existing eight storey reinforced concrete building in a high seismic zone.

The building in question then subsequently went through a number of significant earthquakes and I understand was condemned only because an adjacent building fell into it.

I've also added single and double storey additions to existing URM buildings.

This is very, very, doable. You need to be careful to think through all of the detailing. Happy to help if you need someone to come on board for some help with the initial planning, or potentially even design/detailing/delivery.

 

[XR250]

You guys have any room in Canada for another SE? :>

 

[KootK]

It's a piece of cake for engineers... for as long as NAFTA holds. Good thing I married an American. I'd been planning to return eventually and that may soon be my only path.

I like to debate structural engineering theory -- a lot. If I challenge you on something, know that I'm doing so because I respect your opinion enough to either change it or adopt it.

 

[TLHS]

CEL, was the masonry building in a reasonably high seismic area? I'm curious how you did it. I'd be wary of building a new unreinforced masonry building to the heights you're talking about in a seismic zone. The only spots you really see masonry in Vancouver are legacy buildings, or as infill shear walls on metal buildings. I've done a couple of small industrial structures in it over the years for noise, but that's about it and they're still reinforced by code.

 

[sponton]

@KootK

Why wouldn't you rather stay in your side of the border? The U.S. feels like it's going to implode, construction being the first industry affected, as usual.

 

[KootK]

Why wouldn't you rather stay in your side of the border?

I was toiling away in my little EIT's cube in WI on 9/11. And I saw some stuff in the months that followed. I'm 100% confident that the US economy and democracy will handle this in stride over the long term. You guys are great in a crisis. Besides, while this wasn't quite what I had in mind, I always thought that the US political system needed a viable third party.


I like to debate structural engineering theory -- a lot. If I challenge you on something, know that I'm doing so because I respect your opinion enough to either change it or adopt it.

 

[bookowski]

xr250 - I'm hearing too many people talk about leaving, even as a joke. Sane people need to stay and speak up rather than run. Besides, imagine how much easier our jobs will be now that it's clear that we don't believe in science. Whatever we think at the moment is true. I declare that this w8x15 will span 50ft. wooohoo, I'm the best engineer in the world. beautiful beam, really beautiful beam that spans like you've never seen, big league beautiful beam.

 

[OldBldgGuy]

Just to step back from the political discussion & return to the OP, I'm in Ontario & have added one floor to 4-storey brick buildings in Toronto before and I am currently adding 3 floors to one. I hate this project because I can't do everything I want yet I am asked for miracles (architects!!!), but it's doable. Make sure you know what's going on with soil conditions & foundations, & I've found that treating the top of the brick walls like your founding level of a new reinforced concrete foundation (beam) is the way to start. Avoid point loads onto existing like the plague.

 

[OldBldgGuy]

I should have noted that we are in a pretty low seismic zone & I wouldn't have a clue how to do it in Ottawa, never mind Vancouver.