Anybody had trouble getting software company to renew the licence?

[fredmila]

Here is what I am on about:
A few years ago I bought a licence in perpetuity (it says so in the contract document) of the then SDRC I-DEAS. I then used it for a few years, paying for the maintenance and updates, the maintenance being getting help with the numerous bugs the software had, really. Over the years I paid them a fair amount of money and then I reduced the use of the software considerably and decided not to renew the maintenance and updates payments. Since then, I have had to change the hardware a couple of times and, when I do that, I have to ask the present owner of I-DEAS for a new password to make the licence work. They will not issue a permanent password, to protect their interest.

The first time I had to change the hardware, the then owner of I-DEAS, EDS, charged me some £250 ($387) just for an operator to enter my new lmhost id in a programme and issue a new password. I thought it was excessive then but I decided to bite the bullet as I had already promised an old client to modify an old job.

A few weeks ago, someone asked me to do work with I-DEAS again and I had to change the hardware again. This time it is Siemens who owns the software and they are trying to charge me an extortionate £880 ($1364) just to do the little job of issuing the password again. I complained and they fobbed me off. I spoke to a software re-seller and he confessed that Siemens do not like people who don't continue to pay for the annual maintenance and they catch them when they need help with something like this. Siemens's argument is that I have not been paying the maintenance and update fees every year. My argument is that I have had no technical support, maintenance or updates during the time I have not paid the maintenance fee, so it's not like I have been getting a free ride.

I cannot see anywhere in the original contract that I commit myself to pay the yearly maintenance fee in perpetuity. This is not leased software, it is purchased outright and I believe they should not be able to prevent me from using it with a charge that amounts to extortion. I further think that they should give me a password that works on any machine if they do not want me to bother them with a new password when I change the hardware.

What I believe is that Siemens are trying to terminate the use of my licence outright by giving me an unreasonable charge to let me have a password because I will not pay for all the maintenance years I have not paid just to get the software working again. They keep putting me through to sales people to try and convince to pay for expensive software (NX, Solidedge).

What particularly annoys me is that Siemens must know that I-DEAS (and its successor) is being beaten out of the market by the likes of Solidworks and they are trying to make me pay a high price for a software package that is just about to become obsolete. One of the reasons I started to phase out I-DEAS is because I started having trouble finding work, using this package, when most people are using Solidworks, Inventor, still Proengineer, etc.

Have I got a (legal) argument here?

 

[SomptingGuy]

Not an uncommon scenario.

Does your purchased version of the software still actually run on any contemporary hardware?

- Steve

 

[fredmila]

Yes, the latest version of the software I paid for runs on Windows XP, which is still around.

 

[FeX32]

All I can say is F@#% them!!!! I feel your pain.


Fe

 

[SomptingGuy]

Unless you have maintenance, "the latest version" is unlikely to be given to you by the vendor.

- Steve

 

[fredmila]

I do not want the latest version, I want a password to be able to use the same old software.

 

[djs]

Update and maintenance fees include help with software protection issues. No support, no help. Unfortunately most if not all software vendors are following the same path.

One big issue is that the market for new software sales is pretty flat, so the only source of income for many software houses is the maintenance fees.

 

[ajack1]

To be honest I am amazed that they will give you a password even for £880, every company I have dealt with once you are off contract all support goes, they are not stopping you using the software just tying it to one machine. The likes of Catia go even further once you are off contract you can no longer use the software, or at least that is how it used to be.

Whilst I am not a great fan of the way software companies operate if you look at it from their point of view why would they give you passwords that means you can load your software on numerous machines and would cost them time and money, when there is nothing in it for them?

 

[looslib]

You do have the right to use Ideas forever, as long as you don't need to move it to a new machine. If you had it on an older machine, why not keep it there? If you no longer have that computer, replaced with a faster one, etc, then Siemens has expenses on their side that you should pay for in them giving you a new license. You should now be able to work faster and recover your expense, since you have a faster machine.
Technically, you could claim you have a new computer, pay for the new license file and IF you still had the old computer, run 2 copies of the software.
The fee does seem high, but Siemens has you over the barrel!


"Wildfires are dangerous, hard to control, and economically catastrophic."

Ben Loosli

 

[drawoh]

fredmila,

The moral of this story is that s**t happens.

Software publishers look after their interests, not yours. If you are going to run this stuff, you should have an end of life strategy for when the vendor goes bankrupt or introduces policies that are anathema to you and your business.

Think back on when Linius introduced its EmbassyWorks software for SolidWorks. Eventually, they were purchased by AutoDesk. They pulled their SolidWorks stuff off the market, leaving their customers high and dry.

It is too bad that no one is developing a Free Software 3D CAD package.

JHG

 

[fredmila]

djs:

I would be even angrier if Siemens or its software vendors were to suggest to me that we (the small users and companies) are here to keep them going with our money in times of trouble. If anything, it should be the other way round.

 

[cowski]

It is too bad that no one is developing a Free Software 3D CAD package.

There's this one:

http://brlcad.org/

I've not personally used it, so I can't comment on ease of use, accuracy, etc.

 

[JohnRBaker]

I do not want the latest version, I want a password to be able to use the same old software.

Please contact me via email (take my 'username', add a couple of periods in the logical places and I think you'll figure out what my email address is) and I will forward your issues to someone who may be in a position to help you.

John R. Baker, P.E.
Product 'Evangelist'
Product Design Solutions
Siemens PLM Software Inc.
Industry Sector
Cypress, CA

http://www.siemens.com/plm

http://www.plmworld.org/museum/

To an Engineer, the glass is twice as big as it needs to be.

 

[FeX32]

I know another method to deal with this problem. But I can't disclose it here


Fe

 

[MikeHalloran]

Try putting your old machine's network adapter in the new machine. If it doesn't fit, you're screwed.

You don't necessarily have to _use_ it; you just need its serial number accessible.


_

Mike Halloran
Pembroke Pines, FL, USA

 

[FeX32]

yes...serial number...now we are getting somewhere


Fe

 

[HDS]

It sounds like you had a node locked license. If it was a floating license you would have an easier job. If the licensing is done by the MAC address of the network
card try moving it to the new machine.

You could research if a virtual machine of the old machine would work.

 

[cowski]

If it was a node locked license it may be tied to the CPU id.