Application ASME Code for Buried Pipe 1

[marchieV]

Dear All,

I just want to know what is the applicable ASME Code should I use in the stess analysis of the following pipeline:
- Material: Stainless steel (jacketed w/ HDPE material)

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- Temperature: 45-50degC

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- Pressure: 4.9-6.0bar

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- Pipeline Diameter: 750 mm

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- Service Fluid: Cooling Water (Supply and Return)

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- Purpose: District Cooling System

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- Connected equipment: Pump and Plate Heat Exchanger

Please help me to identify the code to be use.

Thank you in advance...

Sincerely,

marchie

 

[LittleInch]

Whichever one it is designed to. If you've got to the point of steed analysis then you must have designed it to one code or another?

Distinct cooling could be b31.1 or B31.4. If the length is significant I would go for 31.4 but maybe that's because I'm more familiar with it.

Remember - More details = better answers
Also: If you get a response it's polite to respond to it.

 

[marchieV]

LittleInch,

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I agree with your suggestion. But I was thinking of using B31.4 only for underground pipes (which has significance in length) then on the aboveground it will be B31.1 (due to connected pump and heat exchangers/valve manifold).

What are the difference between the two codes? Regarding the allowable, SIF etc..

Thank you.

Sincerely,

marchie

 

[BigInch]

B31.4 DOES NOT apply to district heating/cooling systems. You can see that in the paragraph titled SCOPE (it's the first section).

B31.1 WILL TYPICALLY APPLY

You know somethings wrong when you are thinking of changing codes from above to below ground. Piping design codes are based on TYPE OF SYSTEM, not location, or wether the pipe happens to be above or below ground.

 

[BigInch]

https://www.asme.org/products/codes-standards/power-piping-(1)

 

[JStephen]

It is possible to have applications that don't fall into any of the standard codes. Those codes are set up for common situations, and an uncommon application may not fit any of them.
There are AWWA standards for steel piping. I don't know if they cover stainless at all. Generally, municipal piping is not "stress analyzed" like ASME piping, so it may provide less guidance on that than ASME standards. The AWWA standards would be for ambient temperatures.

 

[BigInch]

(JStephen) Did you see the ASME link that specifically says district heating and cooling systems are included in B31.1
Are you saying that some AWWA code applies to district cooling systems?

 

[pradipgoswami]

Hi MarchieV,

The scope of B-31.1 is as follows:
B31.1 Power Piping: piping typically found in electric power generating stations, in industrial and institutional plants, geothermal heating systems, and central and district heating and cooling systems.

Based on the design criteria as specified,if the intended application is in a power plant scenario, then B-31.1 would be the most appropriate code.

Thanks.


Pradip Goswami,P.Eng.IWE
Welding & Metallurgical Specialist
Ontario,Canada.
ca.linkedin.com/pub/pradip-goswami/5/985/299

 

[DekDee]

BI,
Very interested to read
"You know somethings wrong when you are thinking of changing codes from above to below ground. Piping design codes are based on TYPE OF SYSTEM, not location, or wether the pipe happens to be above or below ground.

and very interested to learn.
I have worked on numerous projects (in the Southern Hemisphere) where the pipe is API 1104 underground and when it comes out of the ground it changes to B31.3 (usually at the entrance to a refinery or petro-chem plant).
I always thought the reason API 1104 radiographic acceptance criteria was so low compared to B31.3 was compensation had been made for the tons of dirt on top of the buried pipe.
Is my assumption incorrect ?
Cheers,
Shane

 

[BigInch]

API 1104 is basically only for welding quality control, as its title implies, "Standard for Welding Pipelines and Related Facilities". Nothing really to do with piping design requirements there, other than perhaps the design of the weld itself. It is valid for pipelines and related facilities, whether installed below or above ground. I always assumed that the weld requirements therein might be considered lower than others, because the risk of danger to high value facilities, life and property is generally lower than what you would find in a refinery, or process plant. Service conditions are generally less severe than what is found in process and power plants too.

I've seen B31.3 used (in error) in many pipeline facilities (pump stations and compressor stations, meter stations, valve stations) in the mideast and other regions, probably because the guys that design pipelines are refinery piping engineers and don't know very much about the pipeline design codes. My advice is to read the scope of each code and you will know what they cover. I always say that, "There is no process in pipelines".

 

[DekDee]

Thanks for the explanation BI

 

[JStephen]

BigInch- the link actually pulls up a "page not found" error.
Regardless, my point was that you can generate a combination of application, materials, sizes, procedures, pressures, etc. that may not fall under any specific code- happens quite often in the tank/vessel world.
On the reference to the AWWA- I was trying to think of what other options were available for large steel pipe- and as noted, I don't think that range of temperature/material is addressed there. I think there are fire-protection standards for grooved piping, and they likely have similar issues.

 

[BigInch]

JStephen, ASME has moved or deleted the page now, but it was just a simple reprint of the scope of each of the piping codes. B31.1 specifically names district heating and cooling systems.
Google "B31.1 Scope" and a large number of links come up all quoting the same.

What can be true for tanks and pressure vessels is not necessarily true for piping as many piping codes reference the same ASME BVP code for tank and pressure vessel design, but some other piping codes may reference others. Does AWWA reference API 650? My point is that if you use the B31.1 code you will automatically be using the correct ASME code and any subsequent provisions for tanks and other components referenced therein specificcally for design of district heating and cooling systems.

 

[DekDee]

As Pradip (and BI previously stated) B31.1 would be the appropriate code but there is also the possibility B31.3 could be used based on the scope (steam, gas, air, water).
Cheers,
Shane

 

[BigInch]

DekDee, Sorry, I'm going to have to disagree there. I don't see any possibility of using B31.3 for district heating systems, under the code selection guideline provided in the introductory section. In order to determine the applicability of B31.3, it is also required to consider the applicability of other codes and standards. "It is the owner’s responsibility to select the Code Section that most nearly applies to a proposed piping installation. Factors to be considered by the owner include limitations of the Code Section; jurisdictional requirements; and the applicability of other codes and standards." When it is so clearly stated in B31.1 that it applies to district heating and cooling systems, "100.1 Scope Rules for this Code Section have been developed considering the needs for applications which include piping typically found in electric power generating stations, in industrial and institutional plants, geothermal heating systems, and central and district heating and cooling systems.", I would argue that, without question, B31.1 is indeed the most applicable code, thereby disqualifying B31.3 from further consideration. I don't think it should be any more complicated than that.

 

[DekDee]

BI,
I clearly stated what was the most appropriate code - if they want to design and fabricate in accordance with B31.3 as steam and water are clearly acceptable what are you going to reject it on ?
The fact they are not using the most appropriate code ?
I worked on a Nickel Refinery (US$4.5 billion) where Outukumpu (who are a pretty big player in fabrication world-wide) installed a major acid plant with all steam and condensate piping in accordance with B31.3.
The code break was where the boiler installation contract and the acid plant contract met.
I thought it should have been in accordance with B31.1 but was voted down by a lot more experienced personnel than myself.
Cheers,
Shane

 

[BigInch]

Codes are system based. B31.3 for process. B31.1 for power gen ... and district heating and cooling. IMO it is not acceptable to use both codes within the same unit, although in a pipe rack between two differing units, it may be the only practical solution. For steam and condensate in a power gen unit, I would use B31.1. For steam and condensate in a chemical process plant, I would use B31.3. Following that logic, steam and condensate piping in an acid plant used for chemical treatment of minerals is certainly a process, so I agree with your nickel plant design criteria team's selection to use B31.3 for steam and condensate within what is actually a "process" plant, as opposed to a power gen plant. I suppose that the boiler could also be included in B31.3, since, B31.3 references ASME BVP VIII, especially if none of the boiler's heat taken off for the process units was actually used for power gen. I presume the code break you mention is B31.3 up to the boiler and BVP VIII for the boiler design itself? Perhaps the boiler would have been designed for ASME BVP VIII if it was destined either for process heat or for steam power gen, or for both, because the piping codes do not include design of the actual boilers in any case.