ASME IX - Minimum Groove Weld Thickness for Fillet Weld Qualification 1

[wdavidchris]

For ASME IX, in general, I am aware that a groove weld during WQT will qualify for all thicknesses for actual production's fillet weld.
However, is there a minimum required thickness for this groove weld during WQT?

We used a 5 mm plate for WQT groove weld, Single-V, GTAW + SMAW. GTAW by other welder/before WQT; The GTAW pass was about 4mm and the SMAW (excluding capping/reinforcement) was just 1 mm. Does this 1 mm pass qualify us to weld ALL thicknesses for fillet weld during production for the SMAW process?

During production, the joints are all T-Joint fillet weld using SMAW process.

 

[david339933]

Good Engineering Judgement is hard to come by these days......

 

[ethan18]

@wdavischris, variations of this question are bound to arise. There is nothing in Section IX to prevent this. A welder qualified on a 1 mm thick groove weld coupon IS qualified to make all fillet sizes, on all base metal thicknesses, and on all pipe diameters. But like david339933 says, this would not be good judgment. A better idea would be to have the welder make a full 1/2 inch thick groove weld coupon, and then allow him to run amok on all fillet welds.

@david339933, if you see - the whole QW-452.6 appears to cock a snook at engineering judgment. How can a welder qualified on a thin groove, say 5 mm thick, make a 50 mm size fillet weld, on a 50 mm thick pipe of OD 500 mm. Sounds too liberal? But Section IX very much intends this.

Another case of shady engineering judgment would be to allow renewal of an expired welder qualification (say a 6G qualification, on a pipe of OD 2 inches, thickness 1/2 inch) on a simple 1G plate coupon of 3/16 inch thickness. But Section IX very much allows this at QW-322.

 

[wdavidchris]

@ethan18 I actually find the 6 month validity/renewal portion really annoying. And this is due to the environment / work culture here (in Malaysia). We are a project management organization and we subcontract the welding to another company. For the job we do, we use our WPS and WPQ (from their prior WQT with us). Since we only use the subcontractor for actually project periods (and nothing between projects), they will be employed elsewhere often. So, they will be actively welding/working all year round, and I/we have no concerns about their ability to weld (since we qualified them before and know that they are active with us or another fabricator).
So, basically, the 6 months often lapses. And we run into issues with our clients/owners when we want to use these welders again without having to do the WQT (since we are certain that the welder is good).

 

[DekDee]

If they are employed by the sub-contractor why is the sub-contractor not maintaining a Welder Continuity Log ?

 

[wdavidchris]

@DekDee The subcontractors and welders are very free spirit, nomadic, very blue collar, informal type. It's more of a crew of workers (welders, fitter, semiskill, riggers,etc) with ability. Mostly uneducated (formally), so anything Code/Engineering/Standard related is something they leave to companies like ours.

 

[DekDee]

wdavidchris,
I have lived in Thailand for 15 years, worked in Thailand for 6 yrs, worked in Malaysia for 3 yrs, worked in China 2 yrs, now in Phillipines for the past 18 months.
Never had an issue with welder continuity before as all my projects have been destined for clients in Australia - they will not accept (usually) welder continuity.
New quals for every project.
Cheers,
Shane

 

[DekDee]

What about asking the Supervisor of the welders to get a copy of an NDT report - UT, RT, MT, PT - even VT.
That will give you the necessary evidence to update your continuity log ?

 

[wdavidchris]

@DekDee That suggestion of getting the NDT report is improbable mostly. The NDT records will be fully kept by their (Supervisor + his welders (and fitters,team)) contractor / client's QC Department (basically the 'me' but from a competitor company). Getting this document will not be likely.
Tbh, generally, if my job doesn't involve an 'engineering client' (adheres to the Code, or has knowledge, or is just a factory/operations people), I'll use these welders directly, without retesting. I'm not saying I muddy the welder continuity forms (neither am I saying I don't); but since I have assurance in their ability (from past projects), unless they recently suffered a stroke or accident, their welding ability isn't a concern to me (and my QC department).