ASME Stamp - company location issue 1

[XL83NL]

I have a manufacturer that produces items which are certified to ASME, and they hold an ASME stamp for this product. The ASME stamp is (also) physically applied to the product. The certificate they hold mentions

Manufacturer of ... at the above location only

Location for the production is in Germany.

Now, the MFR mentioned to me they produce these fittings in Asia (China). I mentioned to him their certificate spells out their production location, which (obviously) is different from what he says. His reply was that their QA guy in their Asian facility is part of their German ISO 9001 QMS and is on the German payroll, and hence, they're therefore allowed to produce in Asia.

Ive never dealt with a situation like this, and because of the phrasing on the certificate this seems to be a rather straightforward thing.

What is the truth? Can they only physically produce on the location mentioned on the certificate?

 

[metengr]

XL83NL
Where is the location where actual stamping is mentioned by the company? Depending on the Quality Manual parts of manufacturing can be performed at other locations (aka outsourced) but final inspection, hydrostatic testing and stamping must be done at the address specified on the ASME Certificate of Authorization. I can tell you that ASME has formed a Task Group to look into defining field sites, etc for assembly and stamping of pressure parts.

 

[XL83NL]

Not sure, but I can try to find this out. Would that matter, i.e. what if they provide the stamp (also) in China, would that be a serious penalty for ASME to further look into?

 

[metengr]

Before you contact ASME make sure that you have all of the necessary information. They cannot stamp items at two different locations unless their Quality program and certificate allows multiple locations controlled by xxxx. ASME conformance committee takes this stuff very seriously when it comes to misapplication of accreditation.

 

[XL83NL]

I have little doubt this company will misuse their certificate/stamp, the thing is, Im just trying to understand the procedure.

 

[metengr]

It may well be that this company has two ASME Certifications because of differing locations.

 

[marty007]

I have little doubt this company will misuse their certificate/stamp

If you don't trust them, then why are you doing business with them?

 

[XL83NL]

I didn't say that

 

[pradipgoswami]

Hi XL83NL,

Everything is global nowadays. Many shops in Asia are certified to ASME and manufacture quality products which meets or exceed the quality requirements of North American or European codes.
All of the testing and inspection services organizations, say TUV, DNVGL, LR have large offices in China. It may be worthwhile to send-an inspection assignments to these organizations and get the first hand report about your supplier's quality norms in China, if there are doubts.

It's very much possible that sub-supplier may have ASME stamp. Search here:

http://caconnect.asme.org/CertificateHolderSearch/Index.

Also one thing to know ASME stamp applies to final finished product. It's not mandatory that suppliers of smaller components, e.g forging, plates,fittings should hold ASME stamp.Other quality norms say ISO is equally good these days.

Thanks.


Pradip Goswami,P.Eng.IWE
Welding & Metallurgical Specialist
Ontario,Canada.
ca.linkedin.com/pub/pradip-goswami/5/985/299

 

[weldstan]

You state "fittings". What are they? Fittings do not necessarily need to be manufactured with a stamp.

 

[XL83NL]

BPE fittings. Their certificate pops up when searching the ASME stamp holder database.

 

[weldstan]

So this fitting manufacturer is an appropriate stamp holder. Then what is the problem?

 

[XL83NL]

Have you read my first post in which Ive stated the issue?

 

[weldstan]

Yes, I did read your post but you did not state which Stamp is at issue. Where as you have stated that the China facility, "BPE fittings", has the appropriate stamp (assume U Stamp), it can certify and document its work under a Partial Data Report. Assuming that the Germany located manufacturer assembles and tests the completed vessel at its German location, it certifies and documents its work on Form U1 coupled with the Partial. This is done quite often.

If the fitting is manufactured to an SA-XXX/SB-XXX materials specification (like SA-234) at the China location, a Partial Data Report is not required.

The German Manufacturer's ISO 9001 QMS does not have bearing on the ASME Quality Manuals required for each manufacturing (Shop) location as required by the ASME. And they may not manufacture the vessel and test the vessel in the China shop and certify and document that vessel under the Manufacturers Data Report and Stamp of the Germany located Manufacturer's facility.

My previous company holds separate Stamps at three different locations and at Field locations. Partial work or component work might be done at one of the shops but completed work would be documented under the Stamp holder completing that work.

 

[XL83NL]

The issue under consideration is a BPE stamp.

 

[weldstan]

If BPE does not have the appropriate stamp, I would suggest a call to the ASME and also speak with the German Manufacturer's AI and AIA.

It is noted that the wording on the Certificate does not preclude incorporation of pressure components from another manufacturer provided suitable documentation is given by the component manufacturer.