ASME Weld Testing - CWI Witness?

[mldolenic]

Hello,
My company has recently started welding to ASME Section IX. I've attended some training on the matter but a lot still seems ambiguous. I've been told a CWI is required to witness all test coupons being welded. Is this correct? We no longer have a CWI on staff so I have some concerns if I need to bring a 3rd party in.

 

[EdStainless]

With no CWI on staff you should bring in someone if you are doing process or welder qualifications.
Who else is going to sign off on the paperwork?

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P.E. Metallurgy, consulting work welcomed

 

[DVWE]

CWI is not required, but someone who is, or has a similar background in welding is highly recommended. Anytime someone tells you something is required in ASME, make them show you exactly where that requirement is written.

The devil is in the details; she also wears prada.

 

[mldolenic]

The plan was for one of our lead engineers to sign off the paperwork or our quality manager. We're new to this which is why I'm on here for advise. So a CWI is required to sign off the the WPS, PQR and WPQ's?

 

[mldolenic]

@DVWE, that's what I was thinking. It's probably best that we do consult with a CWI to ensure the paperwork is up to par.

 

[DVWE]

What would even be better for you is a contracted or hired full time welding engineer.

And no, a CWI does not have to sign of WPS, PQR, or WPQ. Quality manager will suffice. But someone well versed in welding would be better.

The devil is in the details; she also wears prada.

 

[DVWE]

If you do consult with a CWI, make sure they are well versed in ASME. I’ve met a lot in my career that claimed to be, but in reality were not.

The devil is in the details; she also wears prada.

 

[weldstan]

Does your Quality Manager or any other employee have the knowledge and ability to write a WPS? If not hire someone who does. You can always have a test lab to perform the mechanical tests required. Signing the PQR can then be done by the Quality Manager. Do you have anybody knowedgable to direct and supervise welder qualification? If not hire someone who does.

 

[mldolenic]

The quality manager and I have been doing our own research on the whole subject matter but we don't have much welding experience. We've worked with a local lab for some of the testing, so we're contacting them to see if they offer any type of CWI services. Thanks all for your help.

 

[EdStainless]

If the lab has a welding engineer, he would be a fine sign off even if not a CWI.
After all his lab is assuring all of testing also.
And yes, finding someone versed in welding, ASME, and Quality system issues is a big ask.
But it really is what you need.

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P.E. Metallurgy, consulting work welcomed

 

[r6155]

And who will inspect the welds during component production?

Regards

 

[gtaw]

ASME Section IX now has a requirement that the individual charged with recording data while qualifying the WPS or qualifying the welder has to be technically competent and I believe there is recommendations as to what constitutes "technically competent (my words, not ASME. I'm traveling this week, so I can't quote the requirements, but I believe you will find it in Article I of Section IX.

Best regards - Al

 

[DVWE]

Al,

That was added into the 2019 edition in QG-106, and revised slightly in 2021. I just received my 2023 version of the codes and QG-106 remains unchanged from 2021.

Essentially, it requires the organization to define the requirements of competence, qualifications, training, or experience. So, in the spirit of the subject of this thread, if an organization were to write the requirement of a CWI to witness and/or perform qualification tests (procedure or performance) into their Quality Program, then it would be required. Personally, I believe that's where this level of detail belongs.

The devil is in the details; she also wears prada.

 

[r6155]

QG-106.1 and QG-106.4 was changed in 2023 edition.

Regards

 

[riteshk14]

Hello, i am new here. This is my first post. This is a 1.5 months old thread, so i wonder if someone will read what i have to offer. Here is my two cents on this: Section IX does not require a CWI to sign off on a WPS/PQR/WPQR. Anyone who is designated to do this in the organization's quality program can sign on these documents. It could be anyone, as long as he is designated for it.

Though,since 2019 edition - Sec IX requires people responsible for 'supervision and control' of the welding qualifications to be designated, and their competence be established through training records, experience, training, etc. So, OP probably needs such a person, who is conversant with Sec IX, to perform the function of supervision and control. But not for signing on PQR/WPQR alone. That can be done by anybody.

Another thing, if the testing is subcontracted (that is, lab is not part of the qualifying organization), then that lab can only furnish the results. Whether the results meet Sec IX requirements is for the qualifying organization to determine, not the lab. Also, the function of certification of PQR/WPQR must be done by the qualifying organization; the lab cannot do it. There is an interpretation, IX-07-13 (qs 1), which made it clear - that the work of certification cannot be sub contracted. QG-106 itself states this too, that the function of certification cannot be sub contracted.