csys with sketches

[Crocostimpy]

Just recently, when creating a sketch in a part using my start part, I get a coordinate system created in the Part Navigator also. I can delete it after the fact without a problem, but it's a little annoying to have to do that every time. I've checked preferences and in the customer defaults but can't find any setting that would cause this. It's especially odd because it just started doing it the other day, after months of not doing it. Does anybody know where I can turn this function off?

Mike

 

[JohnRBaker]

What version of NX are you running?

John R. Baker, P.E.
Product 'Evangelist'
NX Design
Siemens PLM Software Inc.
Cypress, CA

http://www.siemens.com/plm

http://www.plmworld.org/museum/

To an Engineer, the glass is twice as big as it needs to be.

 

[jerry1423]

If what you are referring to is the same as what I think it is, then you should be able to delete that coordinate system.
But first you may have to respecify the x (or y) direction of the sketch, maybe relate that direction to a datum plane.

 

[Crocostimpy]

Sorry, this is NX5. And I can delete them without an issue. Something changed in my start part to cause this to happen all of a sudden. Weird.

Mike

 

[JohnRBaker]

Now is this a start-part that you created or one supplied by us? If it was one of yours, did you replace our system supplied one with yours and if so, have you installed any updates recently?

Note that starting in NX 5, the start-parts (templates) that we are supplying for modeling use, will have a Datum CSYS as the first 'feature' and while it's not mandatory that you have or use a Datum CSYS in your models, they certainly can be useful and so we decided that it should be included in what we consider to be a best practice.

John R. Baker, P.E.
Product 'Evangelist'
NX Design
Siemens PLM Software Inc.
Cypress, CA

http://www.siemens.com/plm

http://www.plmworld.org/museum/

To an Engineer, the glass is twice as big as it needs to be.

 

[Crocostimpy]

I want to say I created it myself, but I may have copied one that came with the install. All I probably did was copy it to our network disk, and create a Palette that points to it. I open it and then save it to something else before starting to work. I did this because I plan on having the rest of the users here start from the same part.

I changed quite a few things in the preferences, etc., like text and arrowhead size in drafting to match what my company standards are, and stuff in modeling to match my needs. The only thing in the part - in modeling mode - are the three default datums and an axis. There is no csys in the part. At not least when it is first opened up anyways.

Mike

 

[JohnRBaker]

You mention 3 Datum Planes and an Axis. Does the attached image look like what you see in the Part navigator?

John R. Baker, P.E.
Product 'Evangelist'
NX Design
Siemens PLM Software Inc.
Cypress, CA

http://www.siemens.com/plm

http://www.plmworld.org/museum/

To an Engineer, the glass is twice as big as it needs to be.

 

[Crocostimpy]

Yes. That's what I see after I create a sketch.

Mike

 

[JohnRBaker]

Are you saying that if you have an new empty part file and you create a sketch, after you create the sketch that you can then delete the Datum CSYS that was created and you have no problems? That's hard to believe since the sketch that you just created SHOULD be referencing the Datum CSYS, and deleting it will cause the Sketch to be deleted as well.

John R. Baker, P.E.
Product 'Evangelist'
NX Design
Siemens PLM Software Inc.
Cypress, CA

http://www.siemens.com/plm

http://www.plmworld.org/museum/

To an Engineer, the glass is twice as big as it needs to be.

 

[Crocostimpy]

That's what I thought too. The first time it happened I went to delete it, thinking the sketch would get deleted too, but it didn't. I get a warning that there's a dependency, but when I pick OK the csys gets deleted and the sketch stays. Now I haven't purposely gone into the sketch to make sure it's alright, but I haven't gotten a little question mark next to any of them yet, and I have been modifying the sketches as I go through the design process.

Just to be clear, my start part isn't completely empty. It has three planes and an axis in it. The strangest thing about all this is that I've been using that start part for months now without this happening. It just started yesterday or the day before.

Mike

 

[JohnRBaker]

May I make a suggestion. Why not replace the 3 planes and the axis with a single Datum CSYS? It will only show up as a single object in the Part Navigator, it does not grow and shrink, but remains a fixed size as you change the scale of your display and it provides the following functionality all as a single object:

3 Principle Datum Planes
3 Principle Datum Axis
1 Datum Point
1 CSYS

This is a very efficient and useful object.

John R. Baker, P.E.
Product 'Evangelist'
NX Design
Siemens PLM Software Inc.
Cypress, CA

http://www.siemens.com/plm

http://www.plmworld.org/museum/

To an Engineer, the glass is twice as big as it needs to be.

 

[potrero]

John's got a good point there...

 

[JohnRBaker]

Also, a Datum CSYS can be created so that it associatively references such things as points, faces, edges, curves, etc, so that if an edit is made which causes one or more of those referenced objects to move, the Datum CSYS will also update as well as anything created relative to it, such as a sketch, an Associative Line or Arc, etc.

As I said, a Datum CSYS can be a very "useful object" indeed.

John R. Baker, P.E.
Product 'Evangelist'
NX Design
Siemens PLM Software Inc.
Cypress, CA

http://www.siemens.com/plm

http://www.plmworld.org/museum/

To an Engineer, the glass is twice as big as it needs to be.

 

[Crocostimpy]

I did a little messing around with a part that has nothing but a csys in it when opened. I had always thought that it would take more picks to establish a sketching plane using only a csys. Like having to pick the two vectors that would define the plane. Having never done it I didn't realize how simple it actually is. I think maybe I'll switch to starting with just a csys.

Interestingly enough, the part I was playing with was a copy of the start part I was having troubles with. I just deleted the planes and axis and created a csys. Making sketches did not add an additional csys. So the problem was tied to the fact that I did not have a csys in the part already.

Or in the creation of the sketch itself. When creating a sketch, you have several options to define a sketching plane. One of them is Create Datum CSYS. Even though I have Existing Plane selected (it's the default) it seems like the Create datum CSYS is selected too; although this is not possible. It's definitely an odd situation for sure.

Mike

 

[JohnRBaker]

If however you Select BOTH a Datum Plane and a direction reference that is NOT part of the Datum CSYS, while it will still show the Datum CSYS during the launch of the sketcher, as soon as you're actually in the sketch task itself, the Datum CSYS will no longer be there.

John R. Baker, P.E.
Product 'Evangelist'
NX Design
Siemens PLM Software Inc.
Cypress, CA

http://www.siemens.com/plm

http://www.plmworld.org/museum/

To an Engineer, the glass is twice as big as it needs to be.

 

[Crocostimpy]

Yes, I found that out after playing with it a little more. I also figured out why it 'suddenly' started to happen and what was causing it. It's tied to Datum Axes somehow. If you have three datum planes but no datum axes, you will always get a csys when you make a sketch. Also, if you have just one axis, you will also always get a csys. Apparently, two axes will "approximate" a csys enough that the sketch creation assumes a horizintal reference. One is not enough though.

My original start part had three planes and three axes. One day I realized that I never use two of the axes. I design plastic bottles, and the only time I ever use an axis is to revolve a section to make a round bottle. I used the Z axis but never the X or Y. I had started to delete the two unused axes at the end of my parts, and one day not long ago decided to just change my start part and be done with it. Ever since then I've been getting the csys every time I make a sketch.

Problem solved! : )

Mike

 

[JohnRBaker]

That's what we get for making the software 'too' smart ;-)

John R. Baker, P.E.
Product 'Evangelist'
NX Design
Siemens PLM Software Inc.
Cypress, CA

http://www.siemens.com/plm

http://www.plmworld.org/museum/

To an Engineer, the glass is twice as big as it needs to be.

 

[hudson888]

Make everything as simple as possible but not simpler

Albert Einstein


Make everything as smart as possible but not smarter than the operator.

John Baker

 

[JohnRBaker]

That's always been a problem since the introduction of computers to engineering, people tend to turn off the 'processor' between their ears when they sit down to the processor on their desk.

John R. Baker, P.E.
Product 'Evangelist'
NX Design
Siemens PLM Software Inc.
Cypress, CA

http://www.siemens.com/plm

http://www.plmworld.org/museum/

To an Engineer, the glass is twice as big as it needs to be.