Designing large structures 2

[TORCHMAN]

Those of you that design tall structures (10+ storeys). Where did you get the experience? From one man shows? From working at a local design firm?

I am looking to know if any one man shows actually design taller structures and how you learned it.

 

[dik]

Prior to being registered, I worked on half a dozen 20+ storey buildings. Designing columns and floor slabs (using WSD)under the guidance of the EOR (he was really good). I then designed the columns for about a 10 storey building using USD; the first one in the firm. I'd not taken WSD at university. We were the first class to skip working stress for concrete and steel (1965).

Within a couple of years after being registered I did a 5 storey conc shearwall building, including the architectural work (When I first started engineering, an architect or insurance wasn't required). The developer looked after the electrical and mechanical. I did lots of this type of work. Within a year or two of doing my first 'big' building, I did several highrise shearwall masonry and hollow core buildings (All of them just short of 20 stories).

I just did them... no other experience, other than initial guidance from first EORs. Going back 50 years... times were different.

-----*****-----
So strange to see the singularity approaching while the entire planet is rapidly turning into a hellscape. -John Coates

-Dik

 

[TORCHMAN]

Thanks dik,

I work with a couple of one man shows and they don't do taller structures. I am looking to get that type of experience and I am wondering if I would need to seek employment at a larger structural consultant or if I would be able to find a one man show to learn from.

It is not easy finding a good mentor.

 

[dik]

If you can find a good, medium sized firm, that would likely be the best. I was lucky, my first couple of firms were excellent. Good engineers who had the time to explain/discuss things. It was also a different time... back 50 years when engineering was really a profession.

-----*****-----
So strange to see the singularity approaching while the entire planet is rapidly turning into a hellscape. -John Coates

-Dik

 

[milkshakelake]

1. I used to work for a firm that did some large projects. Learned a bunch of secrets.
2. I hired two people from a large firm to train my office for big buildings. Is it legal and/or ethical? I don't know. They were acting solo, and perhaps violated their contracts.

The bigger question is, why do you want to learn how to do large buildings? Is it an ego thing, or do you have clients with such projects that you want to take on? For me, it was 100% a practical thing. The competitive landscape for doing large buildings is extremely saturated in my market and there's no real money to be made there, but I got one and needed to get it done. I didn't really make anything on it, but it was a learning experience. I'm mostly doing mid-size stuff now.

 

[AZPete]

... back 50 years when engineering was really a profession.

Maybe a new thread to elaborate?

 

[dik]

Nope, not worthy of a new thread...

50 years back, I've done 20 storey shear wall apartment buildings without the involvement of an architect... sealed them and they were done... right from home. Today I cannot do this. In addition, without a Certificate of Authorisation, I cannot offer engineering services to 'the public'. Big change, and not for the better.

-----*****-----
So strange to see the singularity approaching while the entire planet is rapidly turning into a hellscape. -John Coates

-Dik

 

[TORCHMAN]

The bigger question is, why do you want to learn how to do large buildings? Is it an ego thing, or do you have clients with such projects that you want to take on?

100% there is demand in my area. I have heard from a couple of architects so far asking if I can design larger. I believe in my neck of the woods, architects like to hire local and I see the local older guys retiring in my area soon and no one else there to pick up the slack. Really I found the demand is there and will grow in the next 5 years and I want to be ready to do it in this timeline.

When you said you hired experienced guys from a large firm, did they com eby mon - fri? or on weekends? How did they manage it with their jobs?

50 years back, I've done 20 storey shear wall apartment buildings without the involvement of an architect... sealed them and they were done... right from home. Today I cannot do this. In addition, without a Certificate of Authorisation, I cannot offer engineering services to 'the public'. Big change, and not for the better.

Love hearing this. That is wild, I had no idea this was a thing to design without architect's involvement. I did hear from a local architect that he used to to the same thing for maybe 9 or 10 storey buildings and just have an engineer to lateral stability. He tells me to this day, he "engineers" his buildings and has an engineer just check and stamp! I was flabbergasted.

 

[milkshakelake]

If there's demand for it, then I think you should talk to a professor in a nearby university and get some guidance from them. If you're already running solo or a firm, I don't think it makes sense to work for someone else for a while, but that would be the best option.

A lot of stuff about designing large buildings isn't in textbooks. Well, the info is out there in a sense because you can extrapolate the knowledge, but I mean things specific to their design in the USA at least. It's kind of the same thing with smaller buildings, too. You can read up on it, but actual practice is different. I mean things like how to set up your FEM model specifically for larger buildings. And wind load calculations, which are a bit more nuanced than for smaller buildings (like not assuming gust effect factor is G=0.85).

When I hired the experienced guys, they came on weekends. Their company didn't know about it, nor ever will. They got paid pretty well for it. It might be hard to track down people like that. You can't just go on LinkedIn and message people randomly; might raise red flags. I knew them from my Masters program.

Maybe also try to obtain sample drawings. It gives some clues, but those drawings don't give you full insight into the calculations.