Documentation is terrible 1

[thixoguy]

Hi all,

I don't know if it's me, but does anybody out there find that the online help for catia v5 is, for the most part, pretty difficult to understand?

 

[solid7]

It depends on what level of user you are, I suppose.

To be perfectly honest, many of the questions that I answer here on the forum, I pull directly out of the documentation. The main reason that I hang out here so much, is to learn new things, by listening to what others are doing. Then, I chase the answers, and sometimes end up answering a few, based on what I learn. That's not always (or often) the case, but it does happen, occasionally.

My opinion is that it also depends a bit on your personality, and what you expect to gain from the documents. To really know how to use them, you have to get good at using them. Sounds crazy, I know, but the more time you dedicate to using the documentation, the easier it will become. You know, like using Catia...

No, the documentation is NOT horrible. It's just very comprehensive, and being such, don't expect results to come easily, at first. Difficult to understand? I don't think it is, but maybe you could post what you mean, specifically?

---
CAD design engineering services - Catia V4, Catia V5, and CAD Translation. Catia V5 resources - CATBlog.

 

[thixoguy]

Solid7

I am in fact a new user; and like all new things we encounter one tends to get frustrated when we are learning.
You make some good points and, in time, I'm sure I will get better at understanding the documentation.

 

[solid7]

Yes, you will get frustrated. That comes with the territory. Master your toolbox, though - not just what's on the user interface. When you get stuck, post it here. I sometimes like to point people specifically to the file in the help docs that addresses certain problems.

After about a year - if you've disciplined yourself to use the docs, you'll find that they become easier and easier to use. You won't find all the answers, but that's why you have some friends here to help.

Good luck to you.

---
CAD design engineering services - Catia V4, Catia V5, and CAD Translation. Catia V5 resources - CATBlog.

 

[TurbulentFluid]

I do agree. I detest the learn-by-example approach, it covers only how to do this specific thing you're looking at, not WHY is something done like this, HOW can it be done differently, and what happens if you do it wrong.

 

[Slaen]

I can kinda understand what hes talking about. I noticed if you dont know the exact terminology of what you are looking for in the docs you can get overwhelmed by all the results you can get when searching for something there. But over all I find the docs to be pretty helpful 85% of the problems i face in catia i can solve by looking at the docs.

 

[JacobL]

About the only bad thing about catia documentation, is the lack of examples on the tutorial level. I wanted to learn the composites module, but even after sleeping on the docs (printed version) couldn't get them into my head

other parts are good. for most long-time modules the help it quite good, just a little hard to find sometimes.

 

[solid7]

for most long-time modules the help it quite good, just a little hard to find sometimes.

I think that the difficulty in understanding the tutorials has LESS to do with the fact that they're bad - in fact, they're not - and more to do with the overall general backwardness of Catia, in terms of the command syntax.

Things like "multi-instantiation" and "extrapolation" - I mean, why not pattern/array, and extend? However, things have improved DRASTICALLY since V4 in this area.

---
CAD design engineering services - Catia V4, Catia V5, and CAD Translation. Catia V5 resources - CATBlog.

 

[catiajim]

I've got to agree with solid7 about the improvement over V4 Docs.

As for the example method, welcome to DS's idea of training. If you have ever had training using the DS materials, they are awful. They lead you step-by-step, without explaination. Nor do they give you any "open-ended" problems for you to learn to apply these new concepts.

Actually, the best documentation that I have ever seen for a CAD system was the old Applicon Bravo 3 Docs. Each chapter started out with a theoretical discussion of the geometry involved, then progressed to an explanation of each function and sub-function, then gave an example of each. Way back then, these were printed manuals only, and it took about 10 3" binders to hold them.

 

[JacobL]

The really good training material for CATIA is the user companion. It's the way I actually learn to do things, and it's very unfortunate it's only about the general modules of CATIA, not including the more esoteric and expensive modules.

 

[solid7]

it's only about the general modules of CATIA, not including the more esoteric and expensive modules.

That's because Dassault makes a lot of money off of its educational materials.

I looked into becoming a Certified Education Partner late last year, and I couldn't believe what I was told. There was an ungodly fee that was charged just to USE the materials, and a year-end reconcilliation for actual application of the training materials vs. the base price for the "privilege" to access the material. In short - you have to do alot of training to be profitable, and you end up subsidizing "Big Momma." There's no way that they're going to give you an inch, with a racket like that.

---
CAD design engineering services - Catia V4, Catia V5, and CAD Translation. Catia V5 resources - CATBlog.

 

[itsmyjob]

Thanks to Jim for his (as always) good comment about training.

Like him I do not think the DS materials are good. A kid can teach with those documents. The problem is that he would not be able to discuss the modeling process or the kinematics’ join here or there.

I remember when I was teaching V4. Exercises document were the resulting solids/ surfaces with dimensions. It was up to the student to find which function to use and why. Exercises were interactive (sounds familiar when talking about catia...), we used to talk about which way to proceed, and why. Then student would do the solid / surface and then talk again about how easy/difficult it was.

Now, because of budget cuts everywhere, you have to rush training, and because V5 is changing quite fast, you cannot keep your training material up to date then you find yourself teaching with DS material…We cannot blame them for giving what budgets can afford…

If only high management could understand how much money/time they can save with a real good training, they would never cut budget, in fact they should develop training business!

I love training and I have to use DS material, hopefully I know my stuff (at least I think I do) and I do a lot of talking / demos and look at what my students are doing when they work. DS material is just in the background... If only I had more time.....

Eric N.
indocti discant et ament meminisse periti ​