Drawing Submittals - Miami, FL

[DTGT2002]

Finishing a job in Miami and am told by the GC that three original signed copies are required of all drawings to submit to the building department.

Since the introduction/acceptance of the wet seal in Nov. 2009, I have produced an original to hold on file at my office (shoring-reshoring engineer/contractor) and provided copies (opaque and permanent seal/sig/date) for use in submittals and execution of the work.

Previously, I applied my raised seal and signed/dated each sheet as no representation of the engineers seal existed other than the embossing type seal.

My understanding of the reasoning behind the introduction of the statues regarding use of the permanent ink seal was to reduce the needless duplication of drawings and details just to apply the stamp.


Does anyone have any insight as to the validity of the requested three original copies with an origianl signature?

Job specs don't require it and my calls to the Building Department have not been answered or returned.


FL folks, any thoughts or similar experience? I have not had this challenge in other Florida juristictions.


Thanks!


Daniel

 

[Ron]

You might have heard the term "Authority Having Jurisdiction"...well that's the building official and he can require most anything he wants to require. Miami-Dade is pretty tight about submittals as well.

Next, as an engineer licensed in Florida, if you submit a document for public review (building department, record drawings, etc.) they have to be signed and sealed.

Not a big deal...just do it.

 

[DTGT2002]

I certainly agree that submittals and their format is subject to the discretion of the building inspector or official. The statutes take care to also make it plainly clear that requirements beyond the minimums noted by the statutes are the perogative of the jurisdiction or of the specifier.

My big question was are three "originals with original signatures" typical for Miami.

If so, I have a bone to pick with our staff in Miami, we should have known of such, myself included. If not, I would like to see such a request in writing.


I certainly did not intend to imply that I thought my submittals (though no specific requirement for shoring/reshoring details is listed in any city/county submittal checklist I can find, though the building code certainly says they are to be submitted) should not be stamped/sealed/signed.

My conflict is the requirement or request for an original signature. In a context where the seal may be considered valid if it is permanent and non erasable, how is a copy or facsimile different than an original in any appreciable way?




Not the end of the world at all to produce "originals" for my friends in Little Havana as the 36 drawings "blessed" with my wet seal will be remarkably easier than things would have been a few years ago, squeezing them through my embosser, just trying to resolve the inconsistencies between projects and jurisdictions.

It is remarkable how many officials of various roles are unaware of the statutes regarding wet seals. And how many existing codes and ordinances are written very specifically to negate the benefit of the change in state law.


Hope it makes a transistion some day soon.


Thanks for your input, Ron. It is always appreciated.

Daniel

 

[Ron]

Daniel,
I agree it gets onerous at times. My typical is 10 sets, varying from 1 to 10 sheets, plus a calculation package produced 10 times. Each sheet of the drawings, per Florida Law is signed and sealed, plus the signature page of the calcs.

I agree about the wet seal. There have been many times that my hand was sore the next day from squeezing the embosser, so the wet seal change was welcomed.

The typical reason for multiple "originals" is that there are often several agencies involved, other than the building department. Often the building official is a broker for the planning department, the fire department, etc.

I also agree about the lack of knowledge of the building officials. Most of them have never read Chapter 471 and work from passed down "knowledge" as to the engineering requirements.

Ron

 

[a2mfk]

Since you are the specialty engineer, the architect, structural engineer, the contractor, etc. all may want a copy with your actual signature and stamp on it for whatever reason. I gave up long ago trying to figure out what/why clients and jurisdictions require different amounts. I just take the attitude of do whatever my client wants in regards to supplying additional sets of drawings.

Why drive yourself crazy trying to figure out something that probably doesn't have a good answer. Sign and have your secretary or EI stamp them....

 

[DTGT2002]

I printed them all (by I, I mean had the lead E.I.T. do it) and am waiting on specific direction from the operations folks to confirm we have been directed in writing to produce the originals.



Fighting a losing battle, probably not being super helpful to the owner, but maybe I am trying to prove a point to the operations folks.

Apparently, this came up on site six months ago and got a snide response from our field office staff and nothing got passed along to me.

I'd much rather make a complete submittal the first time and stamp and sign all originals on the original date.



I think in many ways, Florida is right and does some things better with their inspection process. But some things sure can be frustrating.


Thanks for the thoughts and feedback!


Daniel

 

[a2mfk]

Feel your pain Daniel, feel your pain... So many times after the fact we've had to send one or two more. Now I add 2-3 to whatever they request unless it is a huge set. And I have had those hand is sore moments!

 

[RacingAZ]

Don't try to fight it. That's the least of your worries. Wait until you get plan review comments.

Do they still have the set up where you can only call a certain day of the week to discuss / resolve the plan review comments? It's like a four hour window once a week for a chance to talk to your reviewer and if you miss that window, you have to wait for another week.