Env Engineering/Water/WW- General Observation 1

[ly05]

I work in a respectable private consulting firm in Northern CA and have 5 years of experience. More and more we are trying to "develop relationships with clients" and getting work instead of truely helping the environment. As a result junior-mid level engineers like me are not getting mentoring because most of the experienced guys are busy marketing the firm, chasing jobs, getting their bonuses instead of spending the time getting the work done and working with young engineers. A lot more effort has been put into chasing projects, developing proposals vs. trying to go a good job on existing ones. Often we have to bid low (i.e. getting inexperienced engineer to get the work done because the experience ones are so expensive, as a result, the quality of work decreases) to get the jobs, because of the huge amount of competition from smaller firms. Ironically those smaller firms are the ones that are able to offer higher salary and varied experience than bigger firms, even though the job security may not be as good as the bigger firms. The field just seems more and more bureaucratic. It seems that people are feeling dejected and I don't know many people that are happy working for the state/local municipalities as well.

I am seeing a lot of jumping ships to another firm or changing careers from my peers. Also I'm seeing people that I know in our field change career or going back to school for PhD, law, etc. I just have the feeling that our jobs as private env. consultants are not that exciting anymore. Switching firms may give me a higher salary but seeing the movement of people from firm to firm I don’t think my company is that much different than our competitor.

I work in the water/wastewater/water resources side of environmental engineering. I understand that the opportunities are often concentrated in some parts of the state where the population and income level are higher at Southern CA and the Bay Area-translation: more tax $$ and more work, but the trouble is I have a family and don’t want to uproot them to the expensive areas in CA.

That's the general sense I got. I thought about the federal government but I have a permanent residence status and I understand US Citizenship is required for most of the federal, navy, or EPA jobs. Any advice and observation from fellow environmental engineers is much appreciated.

 

[bioengr82]

could always start your own company and do things the way you want.

 

[cvg]

5 years of experience is marginal for starting your own company.

You say it is a respectable firm, however, not all firms have the same philosophy. You might check around and find another firm that is more service oriented toward it's clients. Also, with only 5 years, you can still afford to shop around for something else. But don't justlook for more money, look for a better company.

 

[Heckler]

I think you would want your principals marketing the companies talents towards new contracts that just equates to job security for you and your peers. I would suggest getting involved with a professional sociaty in your field to get the "big picture" within the industry. I have never worked at/for a private consultancy but I have worked at CalTrans where I got some exposure. best of luch.

Best Regards,

Heckler
Sr. Mechanical Engineer
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"There is no trouble so great or grave that cannot be much diminished by a nice cup of tea" Bernard-Paul Heroux

 

[EnvGuru]

I am working in environmental consulting for the last 7 years as an Environmental Impact Assessment specialist. I have worked in Netherlands, Belgium, India and Nepal. Presently I am working in Oman. As a consultant, whether for private firms or organisations like World Bank, Asian Development Bank, I found the senior consultants are always busy in getting new projects and they are hardly left with any time for mentoring. However, it also depends on juniors how they can extract knowledge from their seniors. Its not that the seniors do want want to share their experience.

Moreover, I am surprised a bit as in all organisations I have worked, the final output is always reviewed by the seniors and then juniors are told about the mistakes they have made and thats how we learned.

I would advice you not to take hectic decisions, all organisations have some good some bad attributes. If possible widen your horizon by getting yourslf involved in challenging projects.

Best of luck,
Swarnabha Bandyopadhyay
Environmental Consultants
HMR Environmental Engineering Consultants
Muscat, Oman

 

[ly05]

I would love to continue in this field. In my current capacity I am not getting the satisfaction I wanted - I am doing a predesign for a treatment plant facility, the trouble is that facility is likely not going to be built - states are strapped for funds and various bureaucratic reasons like permitting (again, lack of funding from the permitting agencies which means "cut and paste" permitting language that is not specific to each facility), push for more expensive alternative tertiery treatment, etc. I sometimes feel like I am digging a hole for myself.
I have tried looking around for other opportunities but the main hinderance is the lack of mentoring everywhere. Pays are best at the firms where they through you out there to make and live with your own decisions, and a lot of times, chase your own work.

 

[LHA]

Per your request, my advice and observations follow:

I have found that, in my area, bigger firms are the ones that are able to offer higher salary and varied experience than smaller firms, with more job security than the smaller firms. It is curious that you have found the opposite.

I am one of those folks you refer to - constantly switching firms to give me a higher salary - and seeing the movement of people from firm to firm, I don’t think my company is that much different than our competitor, either. I am a good engineer, and I am a consciencious professional. But I am in it for as much as I can get out of it, and I will not feel guilty about that.

Pay SHOULD BE best at the firms where they throw you out there to make and live with your own decisions, and chase your own work.

Pay should be LOWER if someone else has to monitor your design decisions, and/or if you don't bring in business leads.

It is the Free Market, and it is ruthless and brutally efficient. It is not fair, and it can not be unfair; it feeds itself by crushing inefficiency...that's what it does, and that is all it can do.

Remember: The Chinese ideogram for “crisis” is comprised of the characters for “danger” and “opportunity.”
-Steve

 

[ly05]

Thanks for all the comments - with regards to salary, I have seen more cases than I would like to on people using counter-offers to leverage more pay from the firm they are working at...of course we all think that us engineers are underpaid - it seems that that's the only way to get your current firm to increase your salary beyond the nominal 3-5 % a year. My thoughts are that all the movement has made us a more "homogenized" such that firms are not so different from one another.
Yes in my part of the county I’ve seen smaller firms mushroomed out from principals in the bigger firms starting their own business, and they offer a much higher salary to snatch good people away from the established firms. But the work environment may not necessary be good for a younger person with less experience.
I have 5 years of experience with my current firm - what is the typical number of years you have seen folks earlier in their career in your company stick around for? Are you seeing a trend with more people jumping ships at all levels, or has this been going on forever (before I started)?

 

[LHA]

Using counter-offers to leverage more pay from your firm is the only way I have ever seen to successfully get your current firm to increase your salary beyond the nominal 3-5 % a year. You seem to not like the fact people do this...why?

I don't understand how less experienced people are commanding high salaries, or how these small firms are covering the overhead needed to support all the help and oversight they must need. It just doesn't add up.

Since college: I kept my first job for 2 months (temp to hire); second job (first real job) for 1 year, 1 month; third job for 1.5 years; three months extended honeymoon; fourth job for 4.5 years; fifth job for 5 months; sixth job for 10 months so far.

People have probably been jumping ship at all levels forever, how else would they get more money?


Remember: The Chinese ideogram for “crisis” is comprised of the characters for “danger” and “opportunity.”
-Steve