FBE or Yellow Jacket

[bdp6632]

I am having some hard time justifying the selection of FBE coating system for diluent (diesel) and natural gas pipeline. These are 6” and 16” respectively. Operating temperatures are around 40 and 60C. Client is insisting on YJ for normal and YJ2K for crossing while I suggested Dual layer FBE (anti Corrosion + protective coat) and Dual layer FBE (anti corrosion + abrasion resistant overcoat) for crossings. These are System 2A and 2B respectively in CSA Z 245.20. The lines will have a cold bending out in the field and maximum would be 5D. Can someone suggest some rationales why one is better than the other under these circumstances? Soil could be slightly damp at some points but not very damp. There is a small hill too on the right of way. Burial depth is around 1.5 meters. There is no HDD on the right of way. Few road crossings and one small creek.

Please advise

 

[BigInch]

YJ2K with its thicker HDPE layer would seem to provide more abrasion and scratch resistance over FBE and with the 60C I'd specify YJ2K for all portions of pipeline. Not only at crossings.

you must get smarter than the software you're using.

 

[LittleInch]

For those of us not familiar with the CSA code, can you provide some details of what you mean by YJ and YJ2K, system2A and system 2B.

I think I know what you mean, but it is much better to assume responders don't know what your particular abbreviations and systems are than assume we do.
what are these additional coats on to of the FBE? The description is rather vague.

The issue with coatings is that if you prepare the base of the trench and supervise every last spoonful of back fill then anything is good enough. It sounds to me like your client has seen the reality maybe a little more often than you might have which is that neither is ever perfect, the contractor will often backfill even if you've told him not to unless some inspector is there to maintain progress and all it take sis one area of damage on a pipeline to create a hole.

Sure you'll have CP (I hope) and the ground may not be too bad, but for a line to last 25 years plus, what is the cost difference between the two spread over that sort of timescale?

BTW you can't cold bend to 5D or maybe you mean this is the smallest diameter hot bend - not clear.



My motto: Learn something new every day

Also: There's usually a good reason why everyone does it that way

 

[brimmer]

If normal operating temp is 60C for the one line, you will be at the upper limit of regular YJ. Would need the YJ2K or FBE. The way I justify FBE to YJ is with the coating perfromance numbers. Get the CSA 245 coating test resutls side by side and compare (adhesion, cathodic disbondment,etc.) the FBE will be supperior in all categories. The other item to look at is past histoy / success of appying shrink sleeves, which is always an issue. The FBE (especially with abrasion resistsant overcoat) will be superior in terms of abrasion to YJ as well. In the end it is always the same, you deal with a PM on a CAPEX project trying to get things done as cheaply as possible, building pipelines which aren't even in compliance to code from day one, coating is an inconvenience nothing more. It doesn't matter the condition they turn these things over to operations in, they get to walk away.