getting tech info from vendors 1

[shipelec]

I am trying to evaluate vendor components and all I can get from them is "sure, it'll do that!" For instance, I am trying to replace the field contactors for a large DC motor. Vendor says they have something better but has provided nothing but a part number. I need to know what kinds of interface it requires and roughly how it works so I can determine whether it is an improvement or whether it will require too many changes to the rest of the system. I am trying to find out the characteristics of a thyristor so I can specify or evaluate a firing circuit. All I can get is the voltage and current rating. Any hints for getting past the sales engineer to the person who really knows the specs?

 

[TD2K]

Just tell the sales guy he/she isn't providing you the information you need, tell they want you do need and you need a reference for someone with the manufacturer to talk to.

If they are good, they'll be able to get you what you want once they understand it. If not, they'll be likely more than willing to get you a name and get the monkey off their back.

 

[ICman]

Some salespeople put you off on technical answers because:

1. they have no idea of what you're talking about, hence do not know who to ask themselves.

2. they suspect that their product will not meet all of your needs/desires, and don't want to lose a sale.

3. they are trying to protect their product from being copied - may not have a patent or so simple it would be easy to replicate.

4. a close inspection would reveal their shortcomings and they would lose the sale.

5. they want to prove to you how knowledgeable they are.

6. the commission on this sale isn't worth the effort.

7. they're hoping you can come up with some suggestions of things they can incorporate into their product.

8. they have a strong desire to learn about their product and applicaions, so they want to make sure they stay in the middle of conversations between you and their source of expertise.

9. they are just too busy to mess with your stupid questions.

10. their motto: Pay first, Answers later.

It's been a struggle I've fought for 30 years with little success.

. . . Steve

 

[sc]

Simple, no technical specs, no sale. You don't need to know minute details such as composition of allys, etc, but you do need to know dimensions, constraints on use, etc. If they are withholding information/specs that can be learnt once the item is purchased, then there is no reason they can't give you the info up front.

Point this out to the sales person and let them know that you will go elsewhere if they aren't more helpful. All of a sudden they will see the sale slipping away and start providing (hopefully) the information you need.


regards
sc

 

[Binary]

One thing I've done when having trouble with a vendor is to call the main phone number in the Thomas Register and start off by saying "I've been speaking to one of your reps and getting nowhere; I need some help NOW. Please do not route me to the sales dept."

Sometimes it takes a few minutes or hours but I've always received a return call from somebody who knows what I need. It's usually been a VP of Engineering or similar person who either helps me directly or puts me in touch with somebody who can really help.

The other thing to try is going to a competent distributor who may either know themselves or have contacts within the company.

Again, clearly communicate that you're not getting your needs met and most companies will bend over backwards to help.

If not... there are very few components that need to be sole-sourced!!

 

[quark]

Apart from the manufacturer's engineers, the competitor's engineers do know about the products well (and viceversa). The simple (and spooky) way is to call A's engineer and say that B's product seems to be better in a particular way. Now you gain knowledge about pros and cons of A's product from B's engineers.

When I was to handle some instrumentation work for a centralized utility I did the same thing with E+H, Yokogawa and Fischer Rosemount. Initially they thought it was improper but finally I ended up with an offer from Fischer Rosemount (after awarding the work to E+H)which I didn't consider.

Try to analyze what is being told (and internet is a good resource).

Finally I disagree with SC about You don't need to know minute details such as ..... Try to get as much data as possible. It will help you later, if not now.

Good Luck,

 

[ICman]

quark -

A's engineers may not know anything about B's product, or they may know only the "rumors". I know. I've worked for a couple of instrumentation companies, competing with Honeywell (for example). At one company, we found out that HW was replacing our products with theirs, then parting out our (traded-in) products thru their maintenance program. Another company had to get a rep to buy some competitive instruments from HW so they could analyze them. The analysis was revealed only thru the design engineering department for that product, not to the application or sales engineers. We would only get bits and pieces of info to help sell our products.

So, my advice would be to tread lightly on what you hear competitors say. In this case, shipelec may have to buy the parts and analyze them himself.

I've had the same problem when buying "accessories" for my motorcycle. I get the size and material, but I don't know if the item will actually fit or if it will last (or is paintable, etc.). Most of these are out of catalogs, and it's somewhat difficult to contact the company technical people directly (most are distribution companies and don't actually design or build the products). Even if I was able to contact them, they probably don't speak English .

... Steve

P.S. It's Fisher-Rosemount, by the way.

 

[shipelec]

Thanks, everybody, for the input. I see that nobody knows a magic fool-proof method, but it is good to know that it's not just me, and that there are methods that work. As expected, persistence is the best tool!

 

[RDK]

My method in dealing with almost any company or organization is to simply ratchet the question up the chain of command. If a sales rep is not giving me the answers I need I’ll simply call the sales manager. If that doesn’t work I’ll call the regional sales executive then the VP Sales and finally the President.

If I get put off to a lower level in another department I’ll start the process all over again.

I also start the calls off by saying so and so in sales would not answer this question, the manager also would not give me an answer so can you Mr. Regional Sales Executive tell me the dimension of this part?

Depending on how quickly I need the answer, I’ll go up the chain of command quite quickly. I will however give everyone a reasonable opportunity to provide an answer.





Rick Kitson MBA P.Eng

Construction Project Management
From conception to completion

http://www.kitsonengineering.com