HIC TEST for Valves 4

[Forrest79]

Friends,
I am an Engineer of a flange manufacturer. now our company is studying the NACE MR 0175. We know how to do HIC and SSCC test on a flange well now. But recently our company is bidding a project, in this project the gate valves and ball valves are requested to do HIC test, I wonder how to perform the HIC test on a valve?
Should I test all the wetted parts of the valve? It will be a crazy test.
Are there any reference standard? I found no description in the NACE TM0284 about the HIC test for a valve.

Please kindly help me, Thanks a lot!

 

[SJones]

The MR0175/ISO 15156 HIC test is directed principally at items manufactured from carbon steel plate material. If your valves are made from forgings or castings, there could be grounds for requesting a waiver from the end user. If your valves have integral flanges, and you say you know how to HIC test them, then this HIC test should serve to address the complete valve body should the end user maintain the requirement. The HIC test will not involve holding a complete valve in the test solution and should focus only on those parts of the valve where a HIC failure effect cannot be tolerated. The specifics of testing non-plate materials should have been provided by the end user.

Steve Jones
Materials & Corrosion Engineer

http://www.pdo.co.om/pdoweb/

 

[stamario]

Helo;

I need to order some HIC resistant Gate valves, there is example:

50.06-CA075 * GATE VALVE VENDOR'S DEVIATIONS. * DESCRIPTION: Solid wedge, bolted bonnet and gland, back seat, o s y and r.st., reduced bore with renewable or integral seat
• DESIGN: According to API 602.
• DIM. STANDARDS: According to ASME 816.10.
* END CONNECTIONS: Raised Face, smooth finish (125-250 cla).
• MATERIALS: Body and bonnet: A105, trim: A182 grade F316, bonnet gasket:
spiralwound, SS-graphite filled, packing: braided graphite filament with
inconel wire and corrosion inhibitor, bolts/nuts: A193 grade B7 - A194 grade 2H. • STATE OF SUPPLY: HIC Resistant; fully in accordance with the "Special
requirements for HIC resistant materials"
• CERTIFICATES/REPORTS: Conform "The Technical Specification"
• PRESSURE RATING: Class 150
• MISCELLANEOUS: The gasket contact surface shall be formed by a phonographic or concentric finish.
• REMARKS: Man.LVF
• COLOR CODING: Blue

my question is what means "fully in accordance with the Special requirements for HIC resistant materials"
where I can find those special requirments?
Or can someone tell me how to make that order for those valves, and also for NACE valves?
Thanks

 

[gr2vessels]

1. Stanmario, you should have open a new post with your question;- however, the "Special requirements..." you mentioned are probably included in your Client's specification, which you seems to be missing...
2. Forrest,
My interpretation of all the standards and recommended practices referring to HIC do not exclude the valve bodies, even if the apparent reference to plate or pipe seems to contradict my statement. The valve body is just a stressed component in a pressurised system as it is the up and downstream piping connected to your valve. Digging through the various NACE and API standards I came accross a statement in the API RP941, on page 4, under the column of comments, the comment "U"

 

[gr2vessels]

1. Stanmario, you should have opened a new post with your question;- however, the "Special requirements..." you mentioned are probably included in your Client's specification, which you seems to be missing...
2. Forrest,
My interpretation of all the standards and recommended practices referring to HIC, they do not exclude the valve bodies, even if the apparent reference to plate or pipe seems to contradict my statement. The valve body is just a stressed component in a pressurised system as it is the up and downstream piping connected to your valve. Digging through the various NACE and API standards I came accross a statement in the API RP941, on page 4, under the column of comments, the comment "U" which says "After 450 days exposure, 1.25Cr-0.5Mo valve body was not damaged
by HTHA." That is, along with plate and pipe material tested, the presumably forged body of this valve was not affected by the high temperature hydrogen attack.
As you know, only the stressed components could be subject of HIC, therefore you should test only samples from the valve body per NACE TM0284, if the RP941 would give you indication of possible hydrogen attack.
I hope this helps.
cheers,
gr2vessels

 

[stamario]

OK
tnx

 

[stamario]

TNX
I have new Question

If I want to order forgings (valves,flanges...) ASTM A 105 N in HIC resistant quality, I must ask material requirements according to NACE MR 0103 ?

According to this should I ask testing of materials in accordance with NACE TM 0103 or with some other TM like TM 0177 or some other??

 

[SJones]

API 941 has nothing whatsoever to do with H2S service and is to be ignored in the context of this thread. There will be no specific definition of 'HIC resistant' that you will be able to quote to the forging supplier who will most probably ask you what you specifically mean by the term. The only pointers are: avoid chemical compositions that can give rise to hard microstructures, i.e. watch the amount of carbon and other hardening elements, and watch the amount of sulphur that forms MnS and the amount of P which segregates strongly leading to susceptible microstructures. European Federation Of Corrosion Publication 16 should be reviewed for more complete guidance. NACE MR0103 should only be quoted if the valves are destined for refinery or chemical plant service. Use the same standard for H2S service materials as the purchaser has specified for the valve to comply with noting that you started the thread by referring to NACE MR0175 (ISO 15156).

Steve Jones
Materials & Corrosion Engineer

http://www.pdo.co.om/pdoweb/

 

[gr2vessels]

stamario,
you are hopeless, you should read the posting rules on this forum. You should also read the documents you have referenced, to establish which standard applies to your work. The applicable standard could be NACE MR 0175 or NACE MR 0103. You should also clarify what you really need the material to be resistant to;- the mentioned standards refer to hydrogen sulphide resistant materials and only indirectly to HIC.
What you should request, is that the forgings have the composition and hardness in accordance to the applicable standard mentioned above. It is the manufacturer's responsibility to provide the suitable certificates issued by recognized testing labs, but is your responsibility to accept or not any certificate issued by shonky manufacturers. For example, you will notice that many posters on this forum have had bad experiences purchasing materials from China coming with forged or false certificates. Please also ignore the advertised Chinese valves on this page as you might end up in trouble if you buy from them.
cheers,
gr2veesels

 

[stamario]

TNX

You see this is the first time that I work with this (NACE,HIC,SSC....) and before I start something i like to inform myself about these conditions.....

These valves and other forgings which I need to order is situated on the HDS/MHC (Hydrodesulphurization/midllehydrocracking) I have found very little documentation about installed equipemnt....

I have found that some equipemnt need to bi in accordance NACE resistant, and other HIC resistant (which I have posted as an example)

I have almost everything about that NACE part in documentation which I have found and collected, but there is nothing about HIC.

This is the reason why I ask those hopeless questions.

 

[Forrest79]

Thanks you all for the information.

Stamario,
We have supplied some flanges successfully which have good HIC resistance performance. For the HIC we have done test according to NACE TM0284 both standard and simulation circumstance. And the results both very good.

For these products you must specify the chemical composition especially the CE, S and P content. also hardness. If content of H2S really high, you can request HIC test and SSC test(NACE TM 0177).

For the valves we still not finished the test, so till now I can say nothing on this.

gr2veesels,
Thanks you help first. In fact I am also from China, but we have same quality thinking and system like Europe and USA, not all Chinese products are poor quality. Yes many of them are garbage, I also think so. Thihking about the beginning of European and American company, you can understand us. The most important thing is we want to change, we are trying our best to improve the quality and we can take profit to both of us. Not problem.

http://www.roc-master.com

Roc-Master website, you can know more about us in the news.

 

[stamario]

TNX

on that plant HDS/MHC on two positions I have concentration of H2S almost 99%, these are the columns of sour water and column for purifying gases with amin

 

[stamario]

on the other part of the plant there is concentration of H2S up to 15% in Gasoline vessel

P.S
gr2vessels sorry for posting here I will try to open new threads in future...
thaks

 

[Forrest79]

oh, both are very high I think. Maybe you can consider Cladding flange and valves. We are now supplying flanges to a Chinese Project named PuGuang, the H2S content also high

1? H2S range?12.31%~17.05%?
2? CO2 range?7.89%~10.53%?
3? Organic Sulfur: 340.6mg/m3 in Raw Gas

Design Temp.?-46? ~ 8 0?

In this project the end user purchased flanges with Inconel 625 Cladding on inside and face of the flanges.

 

[SJones]

Stamario,

The quoted application of the valves requires NACE MR0103 to be applied in terms of sulphide stress cracking (SSC) resistance. For HIC, still take a look at EFC 16.

Steve Jones
Materials & Corrosion Engineer

http://www.pdo.co.om/pdoweb/