High turnover rate 3

[jbelectrical]

I've been working at the same MEP engineering firm for the past three years and am just completely floored at all the great talent we've lost to competing engineering firms (The exception being a non-degreed HVAC designer that completely switched careers). They all leave for the same reason: an inadequate salary and benefits package. Worst of all, my boss, the owner of the company, is indifferent to it! In some scenarios, he doesn't even make the effort of presenting a counteroffer when people initially submit their two weeks' notice.

Our office is comprised of just under 25 employees and the benefits package is sub-par in comparison to both smaller and larger engineering firms:

-1 week of vacation time after 1 year
-2 weeks of vacation time after 5 years
-3 weeks of vacation time after 10 years
-Health insurance through quite possibly the worst HMO in the nation

One of our electrical designers is leaving and his last day is at the end of this week. The firm that he's moving to is about half the size of the one I'm at. I'm beginning to suspect that an electrical engineer will be leaving in the near future, too.

According to my supervisor, this happens every few years. A large group of employees end up leaving, inexperienced new hires are brought on board, and the cycle eventually repeats itself. This just doesn't make sense.

Thanks for listening to my rant.

 

[JAE]

Your boss has a system that he sees as viable.

You have a job at a firm that may not be beneficial to your own career.

 

[quark]

JAE is absolutely right. Everybody works for their own benefit.

One of my previous companies (half a billion turnover pharma, by the time I left about 4 years back)has the same procedure that your boss has. Everytime, one of the thinktanks of the company leaves, we used to think, that was end of the company but the company grew stronger and stronger. They used to elevate a layman and would get the work done with the same quality of the thinktank. There is no notice period. You resign in the morning and you would be relieved in the evening with everything settled. You can rejoin the company if you want, in future.

It was difficult working there except for the kind of responsibilities you have and also for its strange appraisal system. Even a new person would be given huge responsibility (but they have lot of safety checks and cunning methods). You would learn things in a year which otherwise would take you half your life. For yearly increments, you have to just ask how much you want. Either they would give you or won't. No bargaining and no nonsense.

The amount of time and personal energy the top bosses of the company spend, is mind boggling. It is basically 'a lead by example' kind of company.

The main advantage is that they always used to maintain systems. Every thing is well documented so that responsibility transfer takes place bumpless. New people come with fresh ideas so that you can break the status quo. That was their philosophy.

I worked there for 5 and 1/2 years and after spending time at two more friendly companies, I value my experience in that company above par with others. But it is a part of life and I rejected their offer when they called me back again.

To conclude the long post, it doesn't matter if you maintain your system in a good condition. People come and people go but the systems remain.

 

[Ashereng]

I would guess over 99% of the people leave for more money and/or benefits.

The rest already have enought of both.

"Do not worry about your problems with mathematics, I assure you mine are far greater."
Albert Einstein
Have you read FAQ731-376 to make the best use of Eng-Tips Forums?

 

[arunmrao]

I do not see any point in trying to dissuade anyone from leaving. The employee has made up his mind in trying new places,he is welcome to in a democracy. My preventing him might give other employees a sense of indispensibility.

Ofcourse he is welcome to rejoin. This works well in small companies as it is not possible to revise salary structure with every resignation letter.

 

[HDS]

If they are only leaving for money and not for unhappiness that is a good thing. Most places with high turn over it is because of a poor working in environment and conflicts with (mis)management. I have worked at places with 200% yearly turnover in engineering. Most folks got more money when left but that was why any of them left.

 

[Ashereng]

Don't the two usually go hand in hand?

I don't know too many people that are happy to be underpaid?

"Do not worry about your problems with mathematics, I assure you mine are far greater."
Albert Einstein
Have you read FAQ731-376 to make the best use of Eng-Tips Forums?

 

[ziggi]

Money isn't always the highest motivator for people, what's the point of making a huge salary if you have to work long hours for it and consequently never get to enjoy it. An unfulfiling/boring job for high pay is not worth it either in my opinion, all you end up doing is wishing you were somewhere else. And a job which infuriates you will only lead to you coming home and venting on your family, not worth any amount of cash to me.

On the other hand I'm the sort of person who takes a pay cut to work in a position I know I'd enjoy. I went the cash is king route straight out of univ, I hated it and my work reflected my feelings. I tried the do what you like route the second time around, for less pay, and I did exceptionally well, more so than any of my predecessors.

An ideal company for me would be one wherein I can work flexible hours, has a strong company ethos (ie. lots of planned events) and a friendly and relaxed atmosphere. It should also want to send me out to conferences, training etc. and it should understand that I'm a family man first, then a company man.
Ideally if they want to keep me, my workplace should be like a second home, I should not stressed about being in late, nor should I prostrate myself before my boss when my kid ends up in the principals office and I need to go there ASAP.
I'd be willing to work for less money in such a place. And I think quite alot of people from my generation would agree (late 20s/early 30s).

 

[Ashereng]

ziggi,

Good sentiment.

When you are an owner/boss, let me know if this is the ship you run.

Just a thought, this would be a great topic for a new posting.

"Do not worry about your problems with mathematics, I assure you mine are far greater."
Albert Einstein
Have you read FAQ731-376 to make the best use of Eng-Tips Forums?

 

[jbelectrical]

Ashereng,

Exactly. A significant percentage of my coworkers are unhappy with their wages at the present time. The work environment is more laid back and relaxed than any other I have been in (Which is great - don't get me wrong), but it appears that some employees would be more than willing to trade that off for a higher salary. I'm predicting that we're going to become so understaffed that we won't be able to meet project deadlines. And when this happens, we lose clients. Hardly a functional system at all.

 

[epoisses]

purity, why don't y'all come to Europe? 5 weeks vacation after 1 year, not including the compensation days for the French 35 hrs working week which is one day every 3 weeks.
I know there is such thing as too laid back and this system will certainly blow itself up, but I enjoy it as long as I can...

 

[epoisses]

(this obviously does not mean that we don't happily work our @$$es off when we ARE at the office)