hydraulic intesifier/booster in reverse in sorts, good minds please! 2

[LearningDaily247]

I am working this out in my mind but am I correct...?????
I want to use one pump to fill one cylinder but increase force without fill time speed suffering like in a intensifier. So here is my idea, one cylinder presses on a pair of cylinders,which sends fluid to another pair which since working in parallel then doubles the force. big Question is would the output force split at the mechanical conection between first cylinder and the first pair, or as in my head..each cylinder would see the same force? Here is my set up idea........5 cylinders total......

A)my pump lets say out puts 3000psi. It feeds a 1.5" cylinder
bore (1.767"area piston face)single action cylinder via hose.

B)This first cylinder is connected to two more cylinders the same size, ram end to ram end by way of lets say a I beam in between the three cylinders...so first presses on i beam thus collapsing the next two cylinders both in the same direction and forcing fluid out..would the force from the single cylinder split between the pair of would each cylinder see the same force?

c)These two cylinders have hydraulic hose feeding two more same size single action cylinders working in parallel to double the force....

Theory- Since all the piston faces are the same size there is no area ratio increase.But the force is transmitted from cylinder 1 to the next two cylinders through mechanical force without force loss? Then with twice the flow and the same force through the fluid can actuate two more cylinders resulting in double the output force but with no loss in fill time....ie double the force at the same speed. Am i corrct in thinking or have I suffered a miscalculation and screwed up???

 

[Oldhydroman]

Sounds a bit like a student's homework question to me, but put quite simply you just can't get more power out of the system than you put in!

Your first cylinder will push with a certain force: this force will be felt by cylinders 2 & 3. These two cylinders will each "feel" just HALF the force of the first cylinder so (ignoring friction losses) each cylinder will only be working at half the original pressure. The combined hydraulic output of cylinders 2 & 3 will be twice your original pump flow at half your original pressure.

If you feed this output to cylinders 4 & 5 together you will get the original rod speed back (assuming no leakage losses across any of the seals). But, since you now have two cylinders working at half the orignal pressure, their combined force output will be....well, the same as what you started with :-(

DOL

 

[hydtools]

Use a techique called rapid advance where fluid is delivered to both ends of a cylinder. At the time the cylinder picks up its load, fluid is then delivered to the head end and the rod end is exhausted to the return line. It is rapid advance because the effective area is that of the rod during the low-load, no-load piston advance.

Another way would be to supply fluid to the cylinder at low pressure, high flow to advance. When load is encountered, valve in the intensifier to deliver high pressure, low flow.

Ted

 

[LearningDaily247]

I guess I need to recheck my idea, but you can get more power out than put in...ie a simple intesifier. It does just that increase the pressure through area ratio. I instead want to increase flow by using one cylinder to mechanically actuated two. Thus doubling my flow, the issue is I have a very fast system, and theory for static system may not be usefully since the first cylinder is moving extremely fast and in this situation I am thinking by increasing fluid (mass) and fill speed (velocity) I will increase force......am I just beating a dead horse and am crazy or is this a plausible situation? It goes towards and away from different theories

 

[Oldhydroman]

You're quite right... you ARE beating a dead horse.

With a simple intensifier you get an increase in pressure at the expense of a decrease in flow. The output power would be the same as the input power if the intensifier had no losses at all, but friction and leakage losses mean that the output power is actually less than the input power.

If your quest is to create a machine that has a greater power output than input then let me be the first to wish you the very best of luck. My only remaining advice would be to take great care with the filtration - there's nothing quite as wearing as fairy dust!

DOL