Keeping my mouth shut 18

[KENAT]

I have a real problem keeping my (work related) opinions to myself at work.

In particular I always put my foot in it with one of the Engineering Directors.

I know I should just nod/say yes/ask how high but I find myself telling the truth.

For instance he was over today asking one of my colleagues why he hadn’t created a rendered image of our new tool using our CAD system for him to put on his wall yet. Although I tried to be extremely subtle in doing so I couldn’t help but begin to point out it may not be the best use of his time. To do so could easily take an hour and when we’re so behind on a project they had to have lay-offs I can’t help but think it’s not a real priority. While it was fairly light hearted I have a hard time reading this guy.

A couple of weeks ago we were talking about IT prioritization. Someone said that PCs should be assigned based on needs; e.g. the people that do FEA/CFD analysis or model large assemblies etc should get the best PCs with large flat screens, upgraded every year or two. These PCs should be flowed down to less intensive CAD users etc and so on until people that only use their PC for sending email etc get a 4+ year old machine with a 17” CRT. I foolishly pointed out this would never happen as senior staff wouldn’t except some old Pentium and a 15” CRT. The same director didn’t see the funny side, again fairly light hearted but none the less, probably not a very smart move on my part.

So any tips, maybe counting to 10 before inserting foot in mouth etc.

Or maybe any amusing stories to share.


KENAT, probably the least qualified checker you'll ever meet...

 

[GregLocock]

My tip would not be to joke with people you don't know very well. And even then if they look hurt, apologise and explain. My more Machiavellian friends would say that whenever communicating you should consider what exactly you are trying to achieve, by sending the message.

Now of course, those are both excellent bits of advice. I'm sure if I had paid any attention to them I'd be doing something else!

Cheers

Greg Locock

Please see FAQ731-376 for tips on how to make the best use of Eng-Tips.

 

[TheTick]

Currently I am contracting. My on-site report (can't call him "boss") joked that he doesn't have to give me vacation because I am a contractor. I replied that I don't request vacation, I take vacation. I went on to point out that my vacation notices do not contain any question marks or use the words "May I".

Looks I may be taking an involuntary "extended" vacation sooner than expected???

 

[KENAT]

Glad I'm not the only one.

Tick hope the vacation isn't too extended!

I wonder how much of it is cultural, I'm thinking Brit from small Defense company background just doesn't fit well in American mid size semi conductor/high tech company!

I just tried creating the image, as my olive branch/laying down my sword but the CAD system crashes before I can make it look pretty.



KENAT, probably the least qualified checker you'll ever meet...

 

[MikeHalloran]

It's safest to assume that a Director level employee has had his sense of humor shot off in some prior conflict.

Give 'em the Yes Sir/ No Sir routine, don't make jokes, don't repeat rumors, don't make a statement that you can't prove unequivocally ... and don't criticize the bureaucracy, even in jest; it's their baby. Brit humor in particular will be misunderstood in the worst possible way.









Mike Halloran
Pembroke Pines, FL, USA

 

[TPL]

For instance he was over today asking one of my colleagues why he hadn’t created a rendered image of our new tool using our CAD system for him to put on his wall yet. Although I tried to be extremely subtle in doing so I couldn’t help but begin to point out it may not be the best use of his time.

Is it possible that he thought that butting into someone elses conversation might not have been the best use of YOUR time?

 

[sbozy25]

I worked for a Japanese run company, and wow... let me tell you, they do not have a sense of humor. There would be many times, I would crack a joke about a product failure, or recent firing. The Americans would chuckle and find it funny, however the Japanese would look at you like you just slayed the first born of Japan. After a while, I learned to keep my jokes and off the collar remarks to my group of friends, and go with the smile and nod with everyone else.

 

[GregLamberson]

sbozy25

I'll have to disagree a little. I've worked with the Japanese on several proejcts before and have found them to have quite a sense of humor, a little different than ours, but quitre humorous in their own way.

Having worked with them I can tell you they do not take failure lightly, it's deathly serious - product failures and firings (someone failed) is taken as an afront to their honor.

I have to agree with TPL, just focus on the issues that affect you and your tasks directly. If you're asked to comment on IT plans or your co-workers prodcutive time, then by all means say what you think, otherwise I'd stick to the title of the posting.

Greg Lamberson, BS, MBA
Consultant - Upstream Energy
Website:

http://www.oil-gas-consulting.com

 

[monkeydog]

TPL picked up on what I was going to comment on.

In addition, in your original post, you said:
"I couldn’t help but begin to point out it may not be the best use of his time" "To do so could easily take an hour and when we’re so behind on a project they had to have lay-offs I can’t help but think it’s not a real priority"
and
"I just tried creating the image, as my olive branch/laying down my sword but the CAD system crashes before I can make it look pretty."

Can I assume, you were making the olive branch image at work?

 

[MadMango]

I have the same problem. I am leaving my company and my (new) boss was asking me who I recommended as my replacement (middle manager). I told him that he didn't really need to hire a replacement because he had already begun to directly task my people, making it hard to manage the group.

To prevent further foot-mouth collisions, don't say a word, but perhaps written emails would serve your causes better? By the time you get all the vitriol out of your system, you'll have a chance to rewrite a few times, and really make your point with the emotional aspects (and humor) removed.

"Art without engineering is dreaming; Engineering without art is calculating."

Have you read faq731-376 to make the best use of Eng-Tips Forums?

 

[debodine]

KENAT:

Two things I wish to tell you.

First, I read a lot of your posts on this forum and I happen to like your humor a lot. In this forum your humor is normally right on target.

Second, I share your characteristic of opening my mouth numerous times when I really should not. I don't have the answer for you, but in my case I grew up compensating for not being a particularly popular person by trying to be the "class clown". It has been a trait I have fought all my life, with some success but not that much.

The only real advice I can give you is if the target of your humor is yourself instead of someone else, you may be more successful in not hurting relationships with those around you during those times you just cannot get those jaw muscles to clamp shut. I have spoken when I should have been silent many times, but when I make myself the target I find a lot less resentment out there from others.

I hope this helps some.

debodine

 

[waskillywabbit]

Think before you speak.

Stop opening your mouth only to swap feet.

Wear clean socks.



Brian

 

[rhodie]

I deal with the same tendancy, KENAT. All the time:

Proverbs 26: 4-5

4 Don't answer a fool according to his foolishness,
or you'll be like him yourself.

5 Answer a fool according to his foolishness,
or he'll become wise in his own eyes.

 

[prohammy]

Ken

As mentioned before I worked for CAT at one point a few years ago and (I am NOT taking a pot shot at any body) one of the things that I noticed was the difference in humour level that the US guys displayed as you went up thru the management tree. Guys at my level, laugh and joke even into the realms of bawdy humour. Guys above me, serious and restrained. Funny thing was when we all socialised, these work related barriers suddenly came down.

Conclusion, US managers take managing seriuously.

So the advice from me is unfortunately, remember your place and remember that those above you are there to be serious. The more serious you are, the more you reflect them and the better they will like you......

PS I found that SSSOOOOOOOO difficult

Kevin

“It is a mathematical fact that fifty percent of all doctors graduate in the bottom half of their class." ~Author Unknown

"If two wrongs don't make a right, try three." ~Author Unknown

 

[Guest0527211403]

In university I was once talking to a professor of mine about a project I was working on for his course. He said something along the lines of "In chapter xx of my book you'll see the formula..." and my smart-a** reply was "You wrote a book?"... It was the class textbook. I don't think I did so well on that project.

 

[csd72]

Kenat,

At meetings you can waste multiple peoples time at once, so stick to the facts. Only talk if you have something to add to the topic and then only to convince the people that will be making the decision.

Making a joke out of things is important (my father once told me that it is not worth doing something if you cant laugh about it) but there is a time and place for it.

It also makes it seem that you are not taking the task seriously when you joke about it all the time.

csd

 

[KENAT]

Well thanks all, most have confirmed what the smart part of my head says, now I just need to get my heart/mouth to stay in line.

In answer to a couple of points:

TPL: as I meant to imply he was being fairly light hearted and it was kind of a group discussion. So I wasn't really butting in, but it may not have been a smart move to even open my mouth. The IT conversation was also a group effort, but again doesn't mean I was smart to join in.

monkeydog: I was doing the olive branch image at work but A: I stayed late so arguably wasn't on work time. B: while my computer was crunching away I was working on something else so I only spent a few actual minutes on it. I have plenty of stuff to do 'offline' my colleague doesn't so much so freezing up his computer would basically mean there wasn't much of use he could do.

Anyway, off to see if I can make it 10 hours without opening my mouth only to change foot.


KENAT, probably the least qualified checker you'll ever meet...

 

[Comcokid]

Eng-Tips helps me keep my mouth shut somewhat.

There are frequently threads concerning work issues that are bothering me. I post replies to threads that may be humorous or may reek with frustration over current situations. Helps me think through work situations better and vent some of the frustration outside of work.

Although, sometimes after I post something, I want to red-flag myself, but I find people have already replied indicating similar feelings.

 

[SomptingGuy]

I have written many a reply and then just killed it. Like email really. Just a shame there's no delay-send option for one's gob.

 

[JMirisola]

I feel for you, Kenat. I'm originally from the east coast (US) and now live in the overly politically correct Seattle area. I have no problem calling anyone out on the carpet, including senior management, or lobbing a joke, or making an off-color comment. While it took me a while, I finally figured out who/what/when and haven't had (m)any problems. Although I've literally been used as an HR example of how not to act/talk (I used to call the HR manager at my previous company "chicky-poo"), most people look beyond this "shortcoming" and see the value I bring to the group and/or company and that I'm pretty harmless. I guess what I'm trying to say is that self-censorship is hard to learn but can take you far. Just choose your time and targets carefully.

Jeff Mirisola, CSWP
CAD Administrator
SW '07 SP2.0, Dell M90, Intel 2 Duo Core, 2GB RAM, nVidia 2500M

http://designsmarter.typepad.com/jeffs_blog