learning Six Sigma = boring

[atvrulz1]

I am learning six sigma through the expertrating.com website and it is beyond boring. Any survival tips to get through this. After learning the material, you can take a test and if you pass, you are certified as a black belt according to expertrating.com

Process Engineer with Medical Device, Polymer Extrusion and Food experience looking for work in Minnesota.

 

[GregLocock]

http://www.expertrating.com/certifications/sixsigma/sixsigma.asp

It's gonna cost 200 bucks. It may be worth that much. Well, thanks for the heads-up, it made this office laugh.

The reason it is boring is because it is a boring subject. The only thing that makes SS any more interesting than learning statistics from a book, is the teamwork and the real life projects, which of course you aren't getting.


Cheers

Greg Locock

SIGlease see FAQ731-376 for tips on how to make the best use of Eng-Tips.

 

[Pud]

ExpertRating is one of the world's only ISO 9001:2000 Certified companies (from TUV America) offering an Online Six Sigma Certification.

One of the world's only? Is it me or does it not make sense?

And agree - the whole stats/6 sigma stuff is the most mind-numbingly tedious stuff you can do. Probably best done whilst serving a long jail sentence....

Harry

http://www.tynevalleyplastics.co.uk

 

[Neubaten]

I have only a shallow knowledge of SS and its purpose, but I'm highly skeptical about its use (probably SS gurus have a term to designate infidels and non-believers and a proper methodology to lead us to the faith), mainly because when managers bring their mouth fulls of something it's because it's flashy and unuseful or it's labour-intensive and non-concluyent.

What is your general opinion on SS? Has anyone experiences getting proper improvements by using it?

 

[GregLocock]

Yes. I'm not really a hater, they did some good stuff when they repackaged some ancient statistics, some common sense system engineering, and a bit of window dressing to create SS.

What they did was sold it to management first. So you START with a cost benefit analysis. That is better psychology than the usual engineer's approach. The same engineer can get to a solution using SS or not, but he is more likely to succeed in getting the fix into production with SS, because it gives him the structured information to talk to the managers.


Cheers

Greg Locock

SIGlease see FAQ731-376 for tips on how to make the best use of Eng-Tips.

 

[dbooker630]

In my company you have to complete at least three real-world projects before you are considered to be a black belt. I don't know the credentials of expertrating.com, are they recognized by the ASQ?

Try to come up with a business case project, something you (or your management) is concerned about that affects the bottom line. It is even more tedious if you are not in a manufacturing or engineering environment. Having an engineering degree makes the math a breeze, but you must apply the knowledge to something otherwise you will remain bored.

 

[rhodie]

In my experience, the data acquisition and feedback loop for the processes attempting to develop, hold, or certify a 6 sigma standard are themselves not able to validate the metrics within 6 sigma.

This, of course, is primarily due to an end-user bias. When someone is Marketing or Senior Management begins to blather on about the importance of 6 sigma, I tend to let my mind wander. The world of statistics is best left to those who adhere to the discipline of the science, not who wish to leverage the results as a sales technique.

 

[Japher]

I have green belt training and got most of my GB project done before the company "let me go". I still put it on my resume, but I don't say I'm certified. Personally, I think many who say they are certified never did a project and have only the rudimentary book knowledge. I have done plenty of projects using the methodology since, at other companies, and find it only useful to make you look good in front of your bosses.

Many time process improvements need to be made quicker than SS will allow, so it should be a tool that is available and not always used.

If you put SS BB certified on your resume when looking for a job be prepared to explain your projects. If you haven't done any they will know it was a shady program.

 

[GregLamberson]

IMO, SS was a fad that has faded along with the hoola hoop. It was just a fancy way to package the fundamentals and for someone to make a bunch of money.

Greg Lamberson, BS, MBA
Consultant - Upstream Energy
Website:

http://www.oil-gas-consulting.com

 

[csd72]

I could be earning much more money as a six sigma black belt, but after I read my wifes text books on it I knew that my mind would implode.

It is stats, of course it is boring!

 

[IRstuff]

They only fads because companies basically don't want to do the work necessary to become better. Six Sigma is fundamentally no different than Design for Manufacturing (DFM) and all the other erstwhile attempts at improving manufacturing.

I think that if you read up on Deming's work from the 1950s, you'll find substantial parallels with SS. Yet, we don't refer to Deming's work as a "fad" because the Japanese understood his work and recognized what needed to be done, and proceeded to trounce us in the 70s and 80s with significantly better engineered, designed, and manufactured goods.

For the past 40 yrs, we, in the US, have been playing catch-up, with DFM and Concurrent Engineering (CE), but US management would simply jump on the bandwagon for a couple of years and then drop the all pretense of believing the approach and achieving the results.

TTFN

FAQ731-376

 

[TenPenny]

I think that the reason things like Six Sigma are thought of as fads, is because they get lumped into the category of with other trendy business idea, slapped with a catchy acronym for a name, and then hailed as the next great thing.
Written up in every business magazine, plastered on everyone's business cars, etc etc. And then worker bees with nothing else to do jump on the bandwagon as a way of making themselves look special in a world full of middle managers.

Yet, often, the customers don't see any noticeable change in product quality or processes.

Its value is lessened by its ubiquity.

 

[IRstuff]

There's no noticeable change because most companies never implement any changes, regardless of how many people they've sent off to training, not because the concept is erroneous or faulty.

TTFN

FAQ731-376

 

[Dtuck]

I was in a company(that is now closing) that got on the bandwagon of six sigma. Projects involved two engineers and five hourly people, one week, free lunch on Friday and the afternoon off(hourly people only of course). I led a very constructive project for material handling efficiency. The next weeks project rearranged the department making our changes impossible. They did save seven miles per year of walking by one person at a cost of $6,000.00. I asked about the fact that at $15.00 per hour, walking seven miles takes three hours actually saving the company $45.00. Like I said, I only led one SS project. Deming had it right in the first place. Conslultants made up the rest.

 

[SomptingGuy]

OEMs may require and/or favour SS from their suppliers.

Customers of OEMs don't know or care.

I normally laugh when I see that SS stuff on an OEM's business card.

- Steve

 

[dbooker630]

I once had a SS project where we eliminated a mechanical straightening process (and associated scrap) by using statistical analysis of shaft runout after successive heat treatments. The data supported the hypothesis that the process step was not necessary even though it was in place for generations. Where SS has worked best in my experience is when minimal resources (people) are needed to carry it out. If you have to depend on someone to build something, to buy something, that is when the delays start to accrue, the interest wanes and it goes away like the latest buzz word. The concepts are very good but I don't think the intent should be to make statisticians out of all of us, just better problem-solvers. I have heard that Paccar is one of the best at utilizing six sigma, and no, I do not work there!

 

[GregLocock]

SS emphasis on more complex stats is (in my opinion) a ploy to give it an aura of difficulty, rarely justified by the actual data available, or worth collecting.



Cheers

Greg Locock

SIGlease see FAQ731-376 for tips on how to make the best use of Eng-Tips.

 

[csd72]

The more I learn about big business, the less respect I have for business professionals. Many practices seem to be based on psuedo science or even worse, logical falacies.

Take the whole banking crisis. It has been linked back to this one formula for risk that basically made it look like volatile investments were of minimal risk. Banking equivalent of fiddling the books.

In business they can often get away with it, but for us engineers - the laws of physics are strict and unforgiving.

 

[GregLamberson]

csd72

Way off the subject, but have to disagree, the banking crisis was in essence caused by the housing crisis which can be traced back to the Community Redevelopment Act passed in 1976. I won't go into a long dissertation on the history of where we got today, both in the burst housing bubble and the directly related banking free fall that we will be paying on for many years to come.

Greg Lamberson, BS, MBA
Consultant - Upstream Energy
Website:

http://www.oil-gas-consulting.com

 

[csd72]

Greg,

I agree that I oversimplified but anyone who has ever gone for a loan knows that banks are risk averse. How did ordinary banks get involved in such a risky market?

Anyway, back to topic.

atvrulz1,

I always find that putting these things in context makes it a little more interesting. For each subject try to think of it in terms of its application.