New Graduate....Any Advice to Accel? 3

[clemsonengineer2005]

I just graduated form Clemson University. I got a B.S. in Civil Engineering and my M.S. In Civil Engineering also. I did research in Materials (asphalt and my Master's was in Project Management. I some how got into Geotechnical/Construction Services with my current job. I work with a well known testing agency and I am looking for experienced advice on how to accel in this field.

I find it hard to tell a contractor, that i have developed a good relationship with, that a proofroll failed or that they have to undercut or rework. I graduated 2nd in my class with a 3.9 GPA and I guess when I started that I would have a more technical job. I am having to balance the fact that I left a laboratory with well defined specifications and procedures to filed work where nothing seems to be organized or noone knows the specifications to follow. I have many questions in the feild only to be put on hold and made to feel like an idiot when i cannot answer the contractor/owners question on-site. I know some of this could be pertained to the fact that I have not been trained at all for my job. I accompanied 2 fellow employees for maybe one week total before I was thrown onto a job full time where I had no idea what was going on being that I had just gotten out of school.

I do not mean to get on here and bore you with my sad story. I feel like I am not being used to the fullest of my ability. I am curious if others felt this way when they graduated and started their jobs. I know that you have to work your way up and believe me I do not want to say that I am too smart or too educated for anything. I have found myself driving tubes in the field and cooking out moistures and making some cylinders.

Thanks for allowing me to rant a little bit and any advice would be greatly appreciated even if it is criticism.

 

[Zoomzoo]

I spent the first five full years of my career behind a drill rig or backhoe, and on job sites. At the time, I hated every minute of it - I wanted to be a real engineer, sitting behind a desk and analyzing stuff...

Now, decades later, I wouldn't trade that field experience for ANYTHING in the world. And I hunt for reasons to go out in the field now.

It's dues. You gotta pay them if you want to excel as a geotech.

If you don't want to go this route - if you find you don't like the mud, you don't like the wetness, you don't like the contractors, you don't like dealing with the mysteriousness and unpredictability of the ground in a highly litigious society, then find another branch of civil engineering and go with that. Cause the dirt will always be there and the pay will probably never get any better...

Zoom

 

[boffintech]

“I find it hard to tell a contractor, that i have developed a good relationship with, that a proofroll failed or that they have to undercut or rework.”

What the?

No matter what I’m inspecting, upon my arrival to any job site I tell myself, “There ARE discrepancies here. It’s my job to identify them and report them to the powers that be.” If the contractor’s work is in-spec or out-of-spec I don’t really care; my deal is observing and reporting. If the contractor’s work is out-of-spec and remedial work is required to bring the work in-spec then so be it. The owner is paying for a product (building, highway, bridge, whatever) that meets a certain standard and the contractor signed a contract in which he promised to meet that standard. I admit I cherish the moments when I get to do my part in making that standard a reality.

 

[Panars]

The best place to learn what they can't teach you in college is on the construction site. As Zoomzoo does, you will probably cherish the experience you are gaining right now. The fact that you are intelligent and are willing to ask questions practically guarantees that you will advance beyond being a field technician. Keep asking questions, and keep your eyes open for better opportunities. My previous boss went from being a field technician to the geotech department manager. I started off watching a paving crew. You are not alone.

 

[PEinc]

Be patient. Nearly everyone starts at the bottom and works toward the top. You could start by working a little on your writing and spelling.

 

[rchanke]

Go ahead and rant, I did this also. But I also wouldn’t trade my 5 full years of chasing test drill rigs, backhoes, and nuclear gauges for anything. You’ve got to have it to be a practicing geotechnical engineer, or for that matter, any kind of engineer. If you choose to go back to Clemson for your PhD, please remember you still have to get field experience…..and people experience…..and writing experience….and speaking experience.

 

[zcp]

Technical knowledge (your M.S.) coupled with field experience is a deadly combination for an engineer. It moves you straight to the front of the line.

Two pieces of advice:
1) Start making notes of "rules of thumb" and similar things that you see and hear in the field. Then put the research hat back on, pull out the books, and figure out why it is "always done like that". Ask yourself the question, "Did it come from code, science, or old wives tales?"
2) Find a mentor that you can call / take to lunch on a regular basis. He may be a fellow engineer, supervisor, or even the contractor you have developed the good relationship with........needless to say how valuable this will be.

ZCP

http://www.phoenix-engineer.com

 

[SCGeo]

Let me start by saying that you need to decide for sure if this is what you want to do. It sounds like you have the education and credentials to pursue other careers in civil engineering if you so desire. You have put in too much time in school to pursue a career you can't stand.

As a fellow Clemson graduate(May 2004) I can say that it does get better if you decide to follow this route. Because of your technical knowledge and education, it won't be that long before you will be expected to take over in a management position. As such, you will probably be managing and instructing technicians who will be doing exactly what you are doing now. You will need to know what their job entails to properly supervise them, and no geotechnical engineer that I have met in my short time didn't spend some time driving tubes into the ground, making concrete cylinders, or walking behind dump trucks observing subgrade.

I would second what zcp suggests in finding a mentor, someone with experience.

 

[BigH]

Way back when . . . all geotechnical engineers in the Canadian organizations I know were compelled to do field work - as others have said - to chase down drillrigs, dig test pits, compaction control, pile driving/drilled shaft inspection. For most it was at least the first 5 years of their job with a bit of office work. You got to travel from Northern Quebec to Alberta to Northwest Territories - lots of places. And, to reinforce Zoomzoo - it is the experiences that you wouldn't trade for any other. How can you manage projects without some firsthand knowledge of the problems your field personnel are facing - trouble with piezometer installation; losing sand out of the spoon tip, etc. Take all the field work you can get; enjoy the experiences of working out of town; learn; glean all you can from more experienced engineers (mentors) in your group and then put your education to the test as project engineer/project manager! And zcp's two notes are excellent! Good posts all!

 

[Grouser]

While somewhat boring and dirty, this experience will teach you how things are built, both wrongly and correctly. When you know this, you can then design for the "real world". You will also learn which things are more likely to go wrong and therefore, may require more scrutiny when it's your turn to review the field or test reports. All the good civil engineers I know have a background in Geotech/Const. materials.
While a good background, materials testing can become an "easy road" if you let it. Try to get more drill rig/test pit time to learn soil identification and about existing conditions. Then you will be able to discuss projects with the geotech project manager when you are turning in the logs/reports. Offer to help on projects of various types and locations.
Geotech is extremely interesting because of the wide range of situations/conditions and considerations. Is there a coal seam under the site? Try to establish the mentor relationship as best you can. Don't be afraid to ask questions. Join and participate in local/regional professional organizations like ASCE. Try to attend all the training seminars you can. Volunteer to start/manage focus groups in your business and professional organizations.
I think most geotechs are in it for the love of it. It's not the higest paying specialization but management skills will always be in demand.

Best of luck to you and a happy New Year to you and all the forum members/participants.

Cheers

 

[jdonville]

All excellent advice.

If you have a good relationship with the contractor, you shouldn't have any problem telling them that the work doesn't meet spec, if this is indeed the case. Try to keep the relationship friendly and discuss with the contractor how the defect could be remedied. If the contractor is not open to hearing about problems or willing to discuss options for remedying the situation, you will have to play some hardball - and nobody will blame you. If the contractor doesn't like you for this, then they are not the sort of contractor you should be cozy with.

The stupidest questions are the ones never asked - especially if the reason for not asking is fear of appearing dumb. If you genuinely don't know, you are only educating yourself and that's part of your job, too.

Keep asking questions of us.

Jeff


Jeffrey T. Donville, PE
TTL Associates, Inc.

http://www.ttlassoc.com

The views or opinions expressed by me are my own and do not necessarily reflect the views or opinions of my employer.

 

[srshaw]

My first post here--
A few suggestions:
Work on your spelling.
Soak it up, its all important.
Develop Relationships.
A contractor once told me "You're not making any friends" I replied "I got friends in town."
If you want to work in the office, get your PE, you'll want to go back out in the field.

Sheldon R. Shaw PE
Soils Alaska, PC

http://www.soilsalaska.com

 

[bushel3]

I graduated in 2003. I work for a small geotechnical engineering firm. I spent my first six months in the lab and the next six months on the drill rig. While working in the lab and on the rig I never complained and worked as hard as I could. I also tried to learn as much as possible. It started to drive me nuts, mostly because I love numbers and I didn't have to do much number crunching on the drill rig.

After a year of being in the field and a couple of people ahead of me leaving the firm I was able to write my first report. I started off writing small reports. Once my company figured out that I was pretty good at coming up with solutions for geotechnical problems I was allowed to work on more and more difficul problems. Working on more difficult problems has required me to take many different texts books home so I could teach myself how to solve the problem at hand. Fortunately for me my boss likes my standard answer, "I don't know how to do _____ yet, but I can do it." He also likes to teach me and I love to learn. Now I get to write or work on almost every unique job that our company gets. Most of the unique jobs I work on were never mentioned in any of the classes that I took but I get to work on them because I like to learn and am good at solving problems.

My advise would be do your best with whatever task you are presented with and make sure to do it with a good attitude. You'll get an oppertunity when your company needs an extra person to work on a report. If you are good at what you do people will notice and you will be continue to get more responsibility and be asked to work on more reports.