New Graduate Career Decision 1

[SleepyEngineer]

Hi, I'm a bit new here so I guess I'll start w/ 3 parts of my story. Thanks ahead of time for reading.

Part I:
Learning how to make things work has always been a childhood dream of mine. I loved doing it. So when I heard about this place called college, I started being thrilled about going there. I mean, a place where you can fufil you dreams? Well, I stared in the Electrical Engineering program and had a miserable time. I barely passed some of the test and sometimes failed a few tests. I had a horrible time catching up with the HW, sometimes doing it at the very last minute. Except for the classes I took with a few exceptional and motivational teachers, I did close to horrible. I just couldn't find the motivation to study or do anything the teachers wanted me to do. Some even recommend and suggested I chose another career path, far away from engineering. I eventually graduated with a GPA lower then a 3.0.

Part II:
After class, I head home and start reading the Electronic magazines that filled my desk. They talked about amazing and neat things. I researched and researched until I could figure out how the devices inside them worked. I love spending my afternoon's looking at things such as microprocessors, parallel processing, cache conherency, and even (strangely enough) signal integrity techniques. I even had enjoyed spending the time watching the Bob Pease Show. No matter what, even at 3AM on a weekend when I was programming my microcontroller in assembly or discovering the latest VLSI techniques, I was having the funnest time in my life. In a way, it made me forget my horrible mornings in class. Lately, after graduation I had a blast doing digital designs on VLSI software and I'm doing this as my hobby.

Part III:
I've been job hunting now for 1/2 a year now (applied to almost 100 companies) and what I heard is something smiliar to this:

-The 3.0 GPA is the minimum. If it's lower then that or you don't put it on your resume, into the trash it goes.
-Are you sure you want to be an engineer?

I'm not really sure what to do anymore. It seems like the best option for me now is to find a job in another field now and try to save up for the ASIC chip I want to make.

 

[GregLocock]

I don't want to sound mean, but your post doesn't exactly fill me with a burning desire to find you a job. The phrase 'attitude problem' springs to mind.

The good news is that you have a technical aptitude that you enjoy. You need to figure out how to turn that into an interesting career. Or I suppose, find another career and carry on with electronics design as a hobby. That's possible, but there are few things more enjoyable than being paid to do work that you are very interested in.

So, do some research on this site for what other people with poor GPAs have done.

Cheers

Greg Locock

Please see FAQ731-376 for tips on how to make the best use of Eng-Tips.

 

[Beggar]

I just couldn't find the motivation to study or do anything the teachers wanted me to do.

So, as a prospective employer I'd have to conclude that you have a similarly difficult time finding the motivation to study the mundane aspects of our work or doing anything your supervisor wanted you to do.

That's not just a problem in the engineering field; that's a problem in any field.

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[SleepyEngineer]

How do you guys do it without feeling absolutely misrible?

The teachers I do the best with are the ones who tell me the reason why I'm doing what I'm doing, what I need to do, and when do I need to get it done by. If I find a faster/nicer way of solving the problem, they say great do it that way. Their also always avaliable for questions, but again, these teachers are rare. They were worth every penny.

The one's I'm having problems with are the ones who tell me I have to do it just because. Almost all suggestions are ignored. Everything must be done 100% exactly the way they want it too, even if the way they want it is inefficient and timeconsuming, and worst of all obsolete. They are also usually never around, so it feels like I'm trying to mindread what they wanted to be done (usually, I guess wrong). The worst feeling above everything is that I'm paying them to do that.

I guess I'll have to try and work on this more. Thank you for your suggestions.

 

[wes616]

SleepyEngineer! Dude! Welcome to life!

Wes C.
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No trees were killed in the sending of this message, but a large number of electrons were terribly inconvenienced.

 

[HgTX]

"The teachers I do the best with are the ones who tell me the reason why I'm doing what I'm doing, what I need to do, and when do I need to get it done by. If I find a faster/nicer way of solving the problem, they say great do it that way. Their also always avaliable for questions, but again, these teachers are rare."

My first boss was like that. Completely ruined me for any subsequent bosses.

Hg

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[Beggar]

It's a job -- they pay me for my service and I provide that service.

Sometimes, it's a real kick and I love every minute of it. Sometimes, it's a real drag and I hate every minute of it. The vast majority of the time, it's somewhere in the middle and I like it alright but wouldn't be doing it if I weren't paid.

I've worked with and for some great people who I've really respected, from whom I've learned a lot, and in whose company I've thrived. I've also worked with and for people on the other end of the spectrum. Fortunately, the former have greatly outnumbered the latter.

All in all, though, it's just my job. I do it because I'm paid to and that money affords me the things in life that I really do love.

The reasons that you posted for your academic struggles are a huge red flag, at least for me.

Being smart is not nearly enough. The engineering world today is largely comprised of teams. A prima donna who will only do the work that they consider worthy of them and can't perform within the construct of the team and submit to its leadership are worse than worthless -- they are downright destructive.

I don't know if that describes you or not but there's enough contained in your posts to suggest the possibility. Given that, I wouldn't take the chance with you when there are so many others that aren't presenting that potential baggage.

In my opinion, you should spend some time really thinking about how you're coming off to potential employers. Given the intensity of your feelings, I find it hard to believe that you're not communicating them to some degree.

Greg, Wes, and I are all in different specialties and different industries and yet we're all picking up on shades of the same thing. Take that for what little it's worth.

I sincerely hope you're successful in finding something that makes you happy.

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[wirewound]

Hi,

Don't worry about taking six months to get a job. A friend took 9 months but is now well on his way doing software for digital TV.
Try searching for companies that work in the microcontroller/ASIC area within your area of abode. Electronics & Software Companies generally prefer to take in inexperienced people like yourself from the commutable locality if possible.(but not always)
You need to get your "foot in the door" of a target company. -At first, possibly offer to do any job at any pay. As time goes on, and if they don't develop you as you wish, then move on -the fact that you'll have the name of an electronics/software company on your CV will help no end -even if you didnt really do that much when you were there.

 

[BelspringKen]

It sounds like you are more of a hands on guy rather than someone who would love to do diff. EQs all day.

There is nothing wrong with that. Perhaps you should look into being an engineer for a radio or TV station or group.
I knew a guy who did that who had less education than you have, but he had a lot of drive and talent.

Please forgive me if I am off the mark on a career suggestion for your training - I am in Civil.

 

[aardvarkdw]

SleepyEngineer,

My honest recommendation? If you don't want to sit around doing boring stuff(i.e. paperwork, research, answering email questions...) just because that is what needs to be done, you don't want to become an engineer. I am not an engineer myself, but I work with alot of them and I do alot of similar work. They spend 60+% of their time (some of the engineers here may do more) doing exactly what you had a hard time doing in school. Engineering Change Notices, Source Control Documents, Fault Tickets, ad nauseum... This is all stuff you will need to do daily. Many engineers get to spend maybe 2 days a week actually designing or troubleshooting things, fewer actually get to use the theoretical information they learned in school.

Based on your grades and your background, I would recommend you look for a job as an electrical engineering technician, assembler, test technician or something else along those lines. Find something that is in the field you are interested in, but maybe something that only requires a 2 year degree. Not only will this get you something that seems to be more along the lines of what you want to do, but it will allow you to see if you want to become an Engineer afterall. Also another benefit of this is if you look for a position like this at a company that does it's own engineering, you may be able to transfer up after you have proven yourself and then your grades wont matter as much.

Just my $0.02

David

 

[Jabberwocky]

I agree with the above, it sounds like you don't actually want to be an engineer but more of a techie. Again there's absolutely nothing wrong with that, companies need both to get things moving.

Maybe you could take some classes at a technical school? See if they are more to your liking. (mindless) Paperwork is a large part of every engineer's daily routine.

 

[TheTick]

Contract positions are the best back door to permanent employment I have seen. It's difficult to avoid permanent position offers when contracting.

 

[COEngineeer]

Here is what I did.

Graduated under 3.0 in civil eng. I couldnt find a good job so I took technician job for soil testing, concrete. Yes, it is a crappy job but at least I get the experience and some $$ (most of my co workers that did the same thing never finished college).

Went back to school for structural eng.

Found a job with decent pay (due to my experience with inspection) but still not what I really want to do. A year later I found the job I currently have designing houses and I love it.

The moral of the story is, dont be picky with what job to get when you just graduated. Just get your feet wet. Once you have the experience, its ok to be picky. I am sure there are plenty of work out there for EE where the quitting rate is very high. Probably because the job isnt very good thats why people quit constantly. You got to start somewhere!

 

[Ashereng]

Even as a techie, there are very "boring" components. For example:
- documentation
- documentation
- reports
- test reports
- monthly reports
- time sheets

What I interpret from your OP is this: you are currently a "hobbiest", and you are looking for a job as a PROFESSIONAL.

As a professional, you do the job you are hired/contracted/employed to do. Good, bad, indifferent, you do your job.

There are many threads here dealing with a low GPA. Slightly lower than a 3 seems to be quite high, from what I can gather. Keep at the job hunting.

With respect to how to we do what we do? It's call being a PROFESSIONAL.

Good luck.

"Do not worry about your problems with mathematics, I assure you mine are far greater."
Albert Einstein
Have you read FAQ731-376 to make the best use of Eng-Tips Forums?

 

[ELEcontrol3e]

SleepyEngineer

As a relatively recent EE graduate I have three things to say in your defense:

1) EE education is so out of touch with reality. What I mean is that it has become too abstract. There is too much emphasis on theory, and the link of how it pertains to a physical system is non-existant. So the fact that you are doing things with your hands tells me you are on the right track.

2) You're going to be a good designer, in that you have initiative to get you hands dirty and figure things out. The fact that you are taking initiative is a BIG thing.

3) I have to say, and from what I gather this is a very wide problem, there is a high-degree of cheeting going on in engineering. You probably were a solo flyer, and had a huge disadvantage. I saw a lot of cheeting at three schools I went to for my BSEE/MSEE at a state school, and my MSAE certificate at a private institution. I saw a lot of cheeting on an ethnic level.. Whites/Locals with locally born, Chinese with Chinese and Indian with Indian; basically just cliques! I also heard the same things from other students from a wide range of schools.

Still I think the other posts are also correct in some respects. You need to learn the engineering process, the world of submittals, testing, documentation, marketing/application engineering,etc. I wonder did you do a co-op/internship? Probably not.


My advice is to do one of three ways to gain experience.

1) Get a co-op, and start the road to MSEE. You will sharpen your knowledge that you missed in school. Start by reviewing you homework and lesson plans. Then go part-time back to school taking night classes as a student at large. After a couple of classes the first year with a good GPA in graduate school you can get in to most schools. While in graduate school do a co-op for a company where you can learn about the real world. Combine your thesis and school work with your practical experience.

2) Build a portfollio of you projects that you've done. Review all your old work and theory. Merge the two on your own. Take the EIT, its a good review and shows commitment. Prepare to get drilled and practice interviewing. Explain why your GPA was so low, but tell them what you did to correct it. Show some confidence damn it! YOU GRADUATED! Go to IEEE meetings and network. There are tons of technical information being presented too.

3)Learn some sort of engineering software or a marketable platform to be the foot in the door. There is no shame in starting as a tech, but remember you have a degree and a career path that goes with it. Still its a good place to start, but be prepared and willing to do things that are not design oriented.

Above all speak with more confidence! You Graduated you are a @#&!ing engineer! Show the confidence and willingness to learn, and you'll get a job. Be a digital It may take a while, but you'll get there! And remember its a career not a job, you'll grow continually, we all started with a learning curve(S)


JUST DO IT!!!!!!!!! Sorry for the rant on the education system, but I went through a lot after graduation. I really think there is a waste of technical talent in the US. Good LUCK.

 

[oldfieldguy]

If you were into the power side of electrical engineering, I'd recommend that you sign on with one of the electrical testing companies. NETA (

http://www.netaworld.org)has

a list of thier affiliate companies.

I have been associated with many youg EE's fresh out of college while I was in the testing business. They got hands-on experience in the electrical power industry and went on to be great electrical engineers with better understanding of the real-world impact of the knowledge they got in school.

One I know went on to have his own electrical consulting/commissioning company.

Honestly, you'd do well to get out and try a few different jobs on for size. some jumping around is to be expected on a young engineer's resume', and you need to see what's out there for you. There's no sense in working at a job you hate...

old field guy

 

[Beggar]

I guess Sleepy had a hard time staying awake, or he anonymously changed handles. Whatever, he's only logged in 3 times with the last one being on September 24.

Much good advice here but he's not around to hear it.

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