NITROGEN GENERATORS

[laschris]

Hello,
We are interested in purchasing an nitrogen generator for an amada 2kw laser and a coherent 1.5kw laser.What are the pros and cons of generating are own nitrogen verses an upright liquid tank? Also who are the leading manufactures of generators that will work best with our machines?
Thank you,any replys would be helpful in making our decision.
Chris

Chris Belding
Production Metal Forming

 

[krugtech]

the short answer is what's cheaper in your area, electricity to run the N2 generator or bulk liquid N2. On the one's I've seen you can vary the purity with the higher purity needing more electricity to make. What material are you planning on cutting with the N2?

Chris Krug

http://krugtech.com/

 

[10600nm]

Hi, Chris!

I am currently running two 2.2 kW Trumpf CF on nitrogen generator. My model is from "Praxair" - "Laser Star" (see attached file).

I shall note - this unit is not generates high purity N2, but mix: 95%N2 and 5% O2.
For my needs it is OK – I am cutting 1mm thick CRS at most.

It is looks a bit chipper, than bulkpack or liquid tank use.

Last time I had tried to cut my CRS just with well filtered compressed air – with the same result.

Sincerely Yours.

 

[krugtech]

10600nm- If you got the same result using compressed air, then why did you switch over to the N2 generator?

Chris Krug

http://krugtech.com/

 

[laschris]

Chris,
I am cutting 304 ss 22g-10g 90% of the time. I do cut mild steel once in a while using nitrogen or compressed air if parts are not being welded.Thanks for the replys!
Chris

Chris Belding
Production Metal Forming

 

[10600nm]

why did you switch over to the N2 generator?

Sorry, I probably did not express myself correctly: I never used compressed air as assist gas before last days.

Being well brainwashed by Trumpf, (what is obsessed about purity of assist gases) at the beginning I used only high-end N2 (99.99), then due to financial issues I dropped down to N2 of industrial grade, later I found generator is a suitable for our needs and just through last days I recognize that simple compressed air (oil and dust free, obviously) can do the same job.

Hope my savings will cover the price of extra lens.

Sincerely Yours.

 

[LASERNINJA]

Looks like I almost missed out on all the fun.

On site gas .com is company I recommend. I've seen their machine in action at one of my customers in Eugene OR. They run four machines off it. They love it.

Unfortunately, Amada machine do suck the assist gas. When your sizing it my may but expensive, but then again what you pay for Nitrogen isn't cheap either. Depending on your usage, I would expect about a 3 year return on investment.

I've added a "gas consumption cart" take a look at it and it will help you size a unit.

Go with a PSA generator instead of a Membrane. You'll thank me after about 15,000 hours.

 

[krugtech]

I think 10600nm brought up an interesting point- And it's pretty much what I see- If you need high pressure/high volume/high purity N2, the N2 generators aren't really that much better than bulk N2 if at all. In lower purity applications, using clean compressed air usually gets the job done.

The main reason I see compressed air not work is simply because most peoples shop air can't supply the pressure and it's not clean enough. The best part of an N2 generator is it has it's own dedicated high pressure compressor. This alone will cover a lot of applications that are usually done with N2.





Chris Krug

http://krugtech.com/

 

[Mario428]

We switched after 3 years of using liquid nitrogen. Would never go back. In nitrogen's defence the liquid was a better cut but we are somehwat remote and I had to plan a week ahead for my neeeds. The scheduling of making sure I had enough nitrogen without wasting it was a nightmare.
We got the Praxair system and now only spend 1/4-1/3 of what we did on liquid. The other huge benefit is I always have it on demand. The syatem came with a 25 HP Kaeser compressor. It has not been very reliable and the service very poor in my area. You buy the compressor from Praxair but the local Kaeser people have to look after it and I can understand their heart is not in it.
Still would not let it go, has saved me huge amounts of money and hassle.

 

[jetrep]

Mario summed it up nicely. We have the same Praxair setup. The weak link is by far the Kaeser air compressor. It has been quite problematic and the service has been lousy. The generator itself can be a big money saver but I would look into equipping it with a compressor from a different manufacturer.

Cut quality tends to suffer a bit when switching from bulk nitrogen to the generator.

 

[LASERNINJA]

Jetrep:

The cut quality doesn't have to suffer. There is a huge difference between PSA generators and Membrane type. People that have a PSA generator have no deterioration in quality and they don't have to spend $20,000 when the membrane is wore out.

I'm not a salesmen, I don't work for anyone other than my wife. It my felling that if your going to spend the bucks to get a generator, why not get something that fills the need completely. PSA generators go up to 500psi and run at 99% purity. They eliminate the need for liquid and you can pick what ever compressor you want.

P.S. I've had pretty good luck with KAISER. I'm sorry to hear that the feelings aren't universal.

How much does Praxair get for one of their units?

 

[nitrogenjoe]

Krug
Hi Chris
If you do not remember at SMF in NJ we have been successfully using a nitrogen generation system for 10 years. You have been to our shop many times and never even noticed? Go to my nitrogen generation web site or call me anytime to discuss this subject I will be happy to educate you on this technology.
Joe

http://www.industrialsolutionsllc.com

 

[krugtech]

Hi Joe,
You had the only N2 system I was impressed with. It was simple and built like a brick s**t house.

Chris

Chris Krug

http://krugtech.com/

 

[nitrogenjoe]

Chris
So when people ask about Nitrogen Systems for laser cutting tell them who to contact.

nitrogenjoe@industrialsolutionsllc.com

Good to here from you hope all is well.

Joe

 

[LASERNINJA]

Ya that's the one I was talking about.

I think maybe I was mistaken. Joe is the guy to talk to. The product use to be or is On site or use to be. Whatever the case, Yes, What you said about the bricks is accurate.

 

[laschris]

Thanks for all the info. I will let you know what we decide to buy.
laschris

Chris Belding
Production Metal Forming