origin of material

[cmn8226]

hey guys, when they state origins of material must not be from taiwan or china, and I have to order some Stainless reducers what are they talking bout? the original billet, the forging or the finished reducers?

the MTR's are usually domestic since they are machined and forged here in the US. if anyone can enlighten me, that would be great.

 

[JStephen]

You need to ask the "they" involved.

We had run into this once on some ells- seems like the raw tube material came from overseas, was made into ells here in the US, but that wasn't enough to satisfy the requirement. I don't remember how the MTR's read in that case.

 

[cmn8226]

the MTR's do not read any foreign names as long as they get forged and machined in the US. the MTR's read as complete domestic. Now if they ask for Original mill certificates then we have a problem.

On pressure vessel related material do they go with MTR's of the finished product (reducers) or Original Mill Certs when they say 'material should not be from taiwan or China'?

 

[vesselguy]

The intent is the material shall come from a mill in China. Then, the finished product shall not come from a company in China. Taiwan, for those who don't know, is not China. There does not seem to be a problem with Code material from Taiwan, but other may know more.

So, to make it simple, project order would just simply say no Chinese made flanges or tube/pipe, etc product allowed.
Ask for the MTR from the mill to be submitted as part of the document deliverables, as proof

 

[vesselguy]

Sorry made a mistake in typing on the first sentence. It should read "shall NOT come from a mill in China."

 

[cmn8226]

so this usually means the raw material AND the finished product rather than just the finished product.

 

[weldtek]

We're finding more and more our customers are defining 'origin' to mean the original smelting, refining operation, but, if in doubt we ask.

 

[vesselguy]

cmn8226,
To answer your question, "yes".

This all came about around 1992 - 1993 during the "Chinese Flange" incident. At that time some scoundrel in China was selling fake ASME certified ANSI flanges around the world and, of course, things blow up. Since then, and reinforced by recent Mainland Chinese practices, do not buy any product from China for presurized serivces.

To make sure you get good product, buy only from products in Western Europe and America. Last year, we had a bad incident when my last employer purchase all the piping from a mill in Eastern Europe to save money (I think it was Poland), and the pipes split during hydrotesting. Needless to say, it cost them a lot of money to NDE/test the remaining batch in detail.

 

[MJCronin]

To all..

Some other posts you may want to read..

http://www.eng-tips.com/viewthread.cfm?qid=70822&page=142

http://www.eng-tips.com/viewthread.cfm?qid=172967&page=1

http://www.eng-tips.com/viewthread.cfm?qid=45742&page=16

-MJC

 

[deanc]

http://cisgw3.law.pace.edu/cases/990329c1.html

Be careful. The paperwork looks good, all the markings are in order. But some of the stuff is junk.

The list I have is long. My suggestion would be to take random samples and get it tested.

Nothing is free and cheaper is not always least expensive.

 

[deanc]

http://www.aalco.co.uk/technical/datasheets/Aalco_Datasheet_Al_Test_Certificates.pdf

This is a handy reference.