Pervious Pavement/Pavers

[cse53226]

Wondering if anyone has worked with Pervious PAVERS before? I've worked with Pervious Pavement once before but recently the idea of using pervious PAVERS came up in a project I'm working on. The client was thinking of using pervious PAVERS in place of underground storage and or pervious pavement. the pavers would give the site a very unique "high end" feel. The retail center is a "high end/richy" center. The pavers look almost like bricks.
Has anyone used these before?
How do they hold up under normal everyday traffic?
Any problems with plowing and/or freeze/thaw cycle?
I realize that these would be more expensive than regular asphalt but it sounds like they would be cheaper than underground storage chamber?
Any help and/or recommedation for its use would be greatly appreciated.
The site has about 500 parking spaces and about 8 acres of imperviousness. The ones we were looking at are at advancepavement.com. Any suggestions on manufactures in the Milwaukee, WI area?

 

[proletariat]

Well, the upside is that they are easily replaceable if they get clogged, busted by freeze-thaw, or plowed up. No experience with them though. Or, just get bricks and lay them so the holes are oriented on the vert axis. Voila! No expensive uber pavers!

 

[cvg]

I wouldn't count on the pavers eliminating the need for underground storage - but they may help reduce the size since your runoff Cn should be considerably lower than for asphalt

 

[blueoak]

I have seen them in pedestrian areas without freezing working very well.

As for a parking lot, I would be worried about movement. It seems like a flexible paving for base course, but with freezing in your base course you may get problems. I would definitely be interested in cases were they worked well.

I like the idea of storage in the base course, you may be able to limit the amount of pavers then to only inflow requirements and cement them together if needed. May be easier to maintain and repair.
I have seen some areas allow the paving blocks and/or geotextiles that reinforce grass to be used at least in overflow parking areas.

 

[TerryScan]

We implemented pavers similar to what you describe at a shopping mall expansion over an area of approx. 46,000 SF around 5 years ago. The area is rarely used (was needed for required parking spaces), but has performed fine structurally (Delaware for freeze reference).

I cannot attest to how it is performing today in the way of permeability, but I have not heard of complaints from adjoining residential lots regarding runoff.

 

[greenone]

I have seen this in common use in UK and Europe. Lots of parking lots, esp. for sports fields. Seemed pretty good surface to me.

 

[Krite]

I have designed and researched for a permeable paving company in the uk. During that time over 500 car parks/service yards were constructed and no freeze/thaw problems were observed (although frost only penetrates 450mm in the UK). We used to run asphalt aisles onto permeable paver parking spaces to reduce costs. The voided stone sub-base coarse allows for storage and therefore the depth of stone is varied to suit either structural or hydraulic requirements.

I was impressed with the advanced pavement details.

Here are a few links

aquaflow

http://www.formpave.co.uk

uni-ecostone

http://www.uni-groupusa.org

 

[runoff]

CSE;

I have done about 8 jobs with pervious concrete. You really have to watch for load issues with the traffic. The first two were fairly simple because they were small parking areas. The key is the porosity and traffic requirements for the concrete. Be sure you comminicate with your client and get the truth on the amount of traffic. I usually specify a 25 to 30% pososity for the pavement at 6" and gravel base of atleast 40% porosity at 36" deep. The manufacturer can help you. I have used Buzzi Unicem USA and their sales representative. I have found that here in Tennessee the manufacturer is requiring that the contractors go through a certification class in order to lay the pervious material. I found a significant difference between the first and eighth job. The material is getting better as well as the education of the contractor on how to lay the concrete. Cleaning is done on an annual basis and I found that if you have good soils, your under drainage can extend the life with little freeze/thaw problems. However, we do not have the issues of winters that a northern application might have.

I hope this helps.