Pile Placement Disagreement 2

[msquared48]

I have an addition, single story, that was put on a pin pile and concrete grade beam foundation due to the proximity to a steep slope that is sluffing - a critical slope area with a history. When I did the design, I deliberately held the piling line back from the critical slope boundary to allow for future sluffing of the bank, plus included a grade beam for some soil retention under the addition should a failure occur.

That being said, now the City, against the recommendations of both the Geotech, and myself, has insisted on moving the pile line three feet closer to the edge of the bank, if you can believe it, actually slightly beyond the setback line they created themselves. They also want the pile larger and closer together with a deeper grade beam, which I do not have a problem with, but only at the original pile line location.

insert emoticon here

I intend to put a statement on the calcs and plans that I do not agree with the stipulation, holding the City responsible should the pile fail at a later date in the closer location. In my opinion, the second they start making engineering design judgments, which they should not, they incur professional liability, as well as wrath.

I do not expect this to fly, as in obtain a permit, but I am sick and tired of jurisdictions playing engineer here. I am seriously stating that I cannot stamp the plans in the closer location, as that is really the only way to avoid the liability issue here. I have already emailed the Geotech, Architect, and the City, so the stuff will fly soon.

Isn't Engineering fun?

 

[molerat2210]

Why don't you design something that you and the city can live with? If pin piles don't work then use something else. An old and wise geotech once told me that "you cannot fight City Hall".

 

[Ron]

Unless the plan reviewer is a licensed structural engineer and is willing to sign/seal the change and take responsibility for it, then fight it. The municipality is sovereign and doesn't have much chance of being successfully sued for anything...even a failure that they directed.

If your plan reviewer is not a licensed structural engineer, then check your state law for a provision that says something about engineering judgment being overruled by a lay person or entity. In my state, we are required to write a letter putting all on notice that we have been overruled by a lay authority and that we cannot accept the responsibility for the outcome.

 

[msquared48]

That's the way I feel too Ron, and the way I've always played the cards.

I have a phone conversation with him on Monday. We'll see what happens. Thanks.

Mike McCann
MMC Engineering

http://mmcengineering.tripod.com

 

[msquared48]

Just as a talking point here though, can anyone think of a logical geotechnical engineering reason to place the pile line closer to the edge of the bank and the failure plane?

For the life of me, I can't.

Mike McCann
MMC Engineering

http://mmcengineering.tripod.com

 

[Ron]

Mike...I see no reason to do that. Maybe he will enlighten you of a concept that many of us don't yet know...and you can then enlighten us!!

 

[BigH]

@msquared48 - and don't forget to ask him for his calculations to back up his objections.