Possible job offer 2

[pleasehelp]

Greetings one and all.

This may be a bit premature but...

In November last year I had an interview, and did really well, however, I did not get the job, but was told that it was such a close decision that the interviewers (there were 5 of them) were split in their decision.

I was told, later, that a position would probably come up this year and that they would call me and see whether I was interested.

This morning I got a letter to arrange a meeting with a couple of their engineer guys, to have an informal chat about the job.

So I'm hoping that the job will be offered to me.

However...

There are several pros and cons.

The job is 150 miles away, so I would have to move, however, house prices are slightly cheaper.

The pay, based on last years interview, is less, but not that much, but having to relocate, I would try to live a lot nearer (I currently live 25 miles from work and spend about 1.5 hours travelling), so I would save money on travel. The working hours will be less as well.

My current position requires the use of many software packages, 2D CAD, 3D CAD, Microsoft Office stuff. But the new position will be mainly draughting side of the 3D, with the possibility of advancement. Currently there are three people doing the same job, all about the same age. There is little chance of advancement/promotion.

The new companies products are more technical, so the work will be more complex (which is OK) present company are almost metal bashers.

I don't really know the new area well, and have three young kids to consider.

My partner doesn't mind moving, she says its important to make sure the job is suitable, then worry about the personal things.

To me it is more a question of moving for the sake of the family as we will have more time together as well as being able to by a bigger house for about the same money.

Any advice/questions will be welcomed.

Sorry, if this is really long, but this is almost a life-changing decision, should I be offered the job.

Thank you.

 

[ctopher]

You need to look at all sides of pros and cons. I also had the same position as yourself last year and have a family...3 kids. Two are in High school and all 3 are straight A's. I looked at moving to another state, but after checking into the area, we were better off staying because there was a chance of their grades slipping and not being happy losing their friends. There was also the chance of leaving a stable (but unhappy) job and starting new, but not sure of how stable the new job was. Only you can make the decision. I'm rambling, sorry, but I wish you luck. Have to go.

 

[JAE]

There is a book called "Places Rated Almanac" that lists about 330 cities in the US (I'm assuming you are in the US). You can get this book online or in many of the major book seller chains. It lists quite a bit of relevent data on these cities and how they compare in terms of economy, crime, education, transportation, recreation, cost of living, health care, etc.

Pretty good resource for your situation.

 

[IRstuff]

While schools are certainly important, YOU are even more important. That 1.5 hours you spend each day could be spent with your kids. You can make up for a less than perfect school, but the school cannot make up for a less than involved you.

One of the most important motivators for children to do well in school is parental involvement and priorities. When you show that you feel that education is important by being involved with their homework, they'll treat it as being important as well.

TTFN

 

[corus]

You've already said that you're hoping they offer you the job so you can't be very happy where you are now. The only question is if you take this one or another that may come along later. The question you have to ask yourself is whether you work to live, or live to work. If the former then it's just a matter of whether the relocation will be better for your family and you. In the longer term the job offered sounds the pits, as we say, but then there's always other jobs in the future. Ask them to pay all the relocation expenses you'll have.

corus

 

[MintJulep]

As Corus has already said, try to get the new place to pay for as much of your relocation costs as possible. There are signifcant costs associated with selling and buying homes and moving. If the pay at the new job is less, is the difference in current mortgage rates and your present rate enough to make the payback reasonable?

Do your research on the potential new supplier. Are they financially sound? Do they have multiple clients? Do they pay their suppliers on time? Are the employees happy? What are the possible advancement paths at the new place? Do they lead to places you want to go?

If you take the new job, and six months later decide you hate it, what is the job market like in the new area?

 

[twodoorhardtop]

Negotiate for a higher salary, first. If you don't get anywhere, then go for the relo package. Its better to get few thousand in salary than a one time shot of compensation.

Good luck!

 

[automationbabe]

Do what you would have done if you were offered the job in November. How much has changed at your current job since then?

 

[pleasehelp]

Greetings one and all again,

An update on my situation,

Yesterday I reveived a letter confirming the meeting etc. The letter also stated that I was to bring along my passport, driving licence, and qualification certificates, as this would be needed for my personal files. It also stated that a medical could be arranged as this would save me having to travel to the company again.

Reading between the lines, it sounds as though the job will be, more than likely, offered to me.

Ctopher,

My kids are all under school age, so this is not too much of a concern yet, although I hope the schools in the new area will be as good as the ones where I now live. My current position is reasonably stable, I'm not that unhappy, but I'm not overly enthusiastic.

JAE,

Sorry, I'm in the UK.

IRstuff,

Thanks, excellent point.

corus,

I am reasonably happy where I am now, but I was really happy a few years ago, in the same job, so I guess I'm looking to be that happy again. I'll find out tomorrow what the job will be like.

MintJulep,

Some of these points I had already thought to ask, I'm sure the company is sound, judging by their size, and the parent company size.

twodoorhardtop,

Remembering from the previous interview, I think the pay is the same for everyone who holds a similar position, but no harm in asking though.

automationbabe

two significant things have changed since November, a £1000 pay rise, and the company closed one of our manufacturing sites and brought all the work here.

I think the decision boils down to two points, unless there are others that I can't think of.

1) The company make far greater quality products, so the work will be more challenging, its just whether I could handle just doing the draughting side and not the modelling.

2) Will the family cope? House prices are slightly cheaper, the council tax is cheaper, so we could get a bigger house. May not need a car, as I could relocate close to work. This alone would save about £1200.

Will let you know the outcome over the weekend or Monday.

Keep those thoughts/opinions coming though.

THANK YOU!

 

[ctopher]

I hope all works out well
good luck

 

[pleasehelp]

Greetings all again.

The job has been offered to me.

I am really still undecided. Am I happy enough to have a less interesting job, but with a far more interesting company, but gain happier/better home life?


Mmmmm?

 

[jmw]

It sounds like this meeting didn't fulfill all the objectives. You ought to be able to walk away and know you want the job or know that you don't. OK, in the real world we think better after the event. There is no law that says you can't go back and ask for more clarification. You too can ask for another interview.

If you are undecided, both you and the prospective employer need to know why.

You are in a safe position i.e. you have a job.

I would guess the money is OK, you do not comment on it, but you do say you are happy enough that it is a less interesting job.
Is this true, or are you trying to pursuade yourself that this is OK because everything else is OK?

Is everything else OK? If so address this problem head on.

The employer may be able to do a number of things. Add or swap job components, expand the responsibilities. He may tell you this is for the short term but the future holds better things.

There is no law that says you have to have a job you don't like. If you need more interest or challenge, go back and talk to them about it. Find out for sure where the company is going and what opportunities are likely to open up.

If you still have doubts, you need to list out all the pros and cons for your present job, the job you are offerred and your ideal job.

JMW

http://www.viscoanalyser.com

Eng-Tips: Pro bono publico, by engineers, for engineers.

Please see FAQ731-376 for tips on how to make the best use of Eng-Tips Fora.

 

[ezyjack]

Having made 2 major career moves since 1996 (More than 200 miles relocation each), and having just accepted a new position that will require a 1000 mile relocation, I have been in this boat before. I do know that when the offer came, I only accepted because I knew that I was ready to make the move, and the position was worth making the move. If I had any doubts or reservations at all, I never accepted the offer.

I have always followed my first judgement in these situations, and have never regretted it. As I am married with 2 school age children, my wife and I would always research the area as much as possible to discover the school and community situation, and try to make the most of relocating, but if your "heart" isn't in it, my opinion is wait for the right position to come along... you'll know it when it comes.

I hope this helps, and good luck!

From the Laws of Engineering:
Good, Fast, Cheap.
Pick any two...

 

[funnelguy]

A star for that, ezyjack. I was having similar thoughts about this. If you don't absolutely want to jump at the new offer, I would pass. Your gut is telling you something.

I have allowed my brain to overrule my gut on 1 marriage and 2 jobs. All three were less than satisfactory...

Also, relocation can sometimes cause all of those carefully maintained industry contacts to wither.

 

[epoisses]

Pleasehelp,
Agree with funnelguy. It looks like you're searching for support for a decision that you took already in the back of your mind, but hasn't come to the surface yet...
Try the following old trick: if they called you today and told you the whole thing is cancelled, would you feed a relief or would you feel sorry? Try to imagine yourself in this situation as much as possible. And then take the right decision according to what your gut says.
(I just switched jobs and countries a few months ago. My gut was right).
Good luck!

 

[Heckler]

PleaseHelp,

I remember back in the early 90's when all my college buddies were looking for their first engineering job. Degree in head, I pounded the pavement and was extremely optimistic. As my friends started getting job offers I was still without. When it was all said and done with all of us employed I was the most underpaid of them all. Everyone was happy except me! So I made a couple of job changes in the first five years but that didn't really hurt my career since everyone was "job jumping" in Sillycon Valley (Sunnyvale, California) chasing after big $$$$$$ and stock options. Well that lasted for another three years to my dismay. I got burnt out on extremely high living expenses, commute traffic, and a constantly degrading quality of life. I took a job out of the area just as the "tech bubble" exploded and my company laid just about everyone off. I look back on those times as lessions in life but it is really hard to make those types of life changing decisions without knowing the outcome.

Here is the priority list for me:
family
quality of life
interesting job/stable company/professional growth
salary

I know life is somewhat different in the UK but I would do a decision matrix listing all the varibles that affect your daily life. I feel it just doesn't pay off in the long run to chase money verses other more meaningful things. Beacause like it was stated above the more personal time you have the more time to invest in family, friends, and self interests.

Best of Luck & keep us posted.

Vince

 

[pleasehelp]

Greetings one and all,

Thank you to all those who took some time to give me some advice/tips.

Just an update on the situation.

I have just turned down the job offer.

Although the products are far better and the work needing to be of greater accuracy/quality, it didn't seem a great enough improvement over my current position and the pay was £900 less a year.

The house prices in the new area seem to have rocketed, so we would only be able to buy a house similar to the one we currently own.

Yes my family life would have improved, eventually, but in the short term it would have been dreadful, as I would only see my children at weekends, and this time would have been taken up by either preparing out house for sale, looking for a ew house or decorating the new house (Also, who knows how long my house would take to sell!).

 

[jmw]

Pleasehelp, Congratulations on making a decision.
No one can ever tell you that this was the right or wrong choice.

The main thing is that if you make decisions, you are in control, whatever the outcome of any one decision. If you let decsisions make themseleves, you are not. Some people wait for the options to disappear until they have only one choice left.

You make your decisions based on having all the information necessary and the criteria clearly defined.

Once you have made a decision, you get to live with it, good or bad, and you approach the next decision a wiser person.

Heckler makes some good comments.
We none of us have a crystal ball but all of us have hindsite.

This gives us a bit of a distorted view of life.
Hindsite is a wonderful thing but it can only look backwards and not forwards.

If, at some time, we find ourselves looking back and saying "If only..." we shouldn't.

Many people, at some time, tend to worry about what their future would have been if they made a different decision. Natural, but only healthy if what we do is review the decision making process and not the decsision.

In most cases it isn't about the "butterfly flapping its wings" where one path leads to perdition and the other to the realisation of all your dreams. It is about choosing the road to travel today and there are many different routes to the same destination.

You just need to know what your ultimate goal currently is and keep moving in that direction. Test all decisions against the long term goal and you probably will find most of your choices are equivalent. This makes them short term decisions.

Short term decisions require short term considerations.

If your lonmg term goals are very precisely defined then every decision has to be exactly guided along that path. For most of us, being an engineer and being successful doesn't necessarily depend on an exact discipline. If we are going to be a success, we are probably going to succeed in any discipline.

All we need to learn from past decisions is about the decision making process. How to make better decisions and how to stay focussed.

JMW

http://www.viscoanalyser.com

Eng-Tips: Pro bono publico, by engineers, for engineers.

Please see FAQ731-376 for tips on how to make the best use of Eng-Tips Fora.