Promotions in Engineering?

[Senselessticker]

What is the average time for before a young engineer (fresh out-a-school) usually receives a promotion/raise (not counting annual 3-4% inflation raise)? 1 year, 2 years, 3 years, 4 years, 5 years? Anyone have any personal experiences they would like to share?

 

[Ron]

The first milestone is usually registration, with about a 5% raise, depending on company and industry. After that, it depends on merit, company structure, personal drive and ambition, and luck.

 

[Heckler]

Depends what industry? I got my first promotion 18 months out of college with a big fat raise but that was due to the fact they hired me in at a lower rate then the "preferred colleges"

Best Regards,

Heckler
Sr. Mechanical Engineer
SW2005 SP 5.0 & Pro/E 2001
Dell Precision 370
P4 3.6 GHz, 1GB RAM
XP Pro SP2.0
NVIDIA Quadro FX 1400
o
_`\(,_
(_)/ (_)

Never argue with an idiot. They'll bring you down to their level and beat you with experience every time.

 

[ctopher]

It also depends a lot on you. Do you do good work beyond what your scope of work requires? If so, it usually helps with promotions. I have worked with engineers that do min work for years without promotions and min raises.

Chris
Systems Analyst, I.S.
SolidWorks 06 4.1/PDMWorks 06
AutoCAD 06
ctopher's home (updated 06-21-06)

 

[KENAT]

Varies.

My first job I was meant to get a review after 6 months with pay rise based on merit/performance.

Actually got pay rise after 3 months, but just the cost of living adjustment amount not merit. I then had to wait to the next yearly pay adjustment to get a merit based pay rise which wasn't all that impressive.

I then 6 months later out of the blue got a very large pay rise. And from then on my yearly pay rises were above inflation, again based on merit.

So it varies.

I would say your first few years at work your worth grows a lot more quickly than after that and your pay should ramp accordingly (unless you're really well paid to start with).

After you've been somewhere a few (3-5 maybe) years the only way you'll probably get more than cost of living is by some kind of promotion and/or officially increased responsibilities (I say officially because a lot of us just seem to pick things up as we go along without getting the pay raise!) Sometimes for extra qualifications too.

Usually this sort of thing should be discussed before you take the job initially but I know that isn't always easy.

Also remember merit isn't always just merit, many places brown nosing, like it or not, plays a part. I'm not very good at it but some people are.

 

[KENAT]

Forgot to say as regards first promotion, I got mine after 15 months, I was told to drop the junior from my title. This went along with my first merit raise.

Arguably a bit soon to stop being junior.

From then on I acquired more responsibilities but not promotions as such, my job title stayed the same.

Just remembered I did turn down one promotion after about 3 1/4 years, I wasn't qualified/experienced enough and would have fallen flat on my face, no arguably about that one.

 

[GregLocock]

Three years out of uni I was promoted to the top technical grade for an engineer.

Which is where I still am, 20 years later.

Cheers

Greg Locock

Please see FAQ731-376 for tips on how to make the best use of Eng-Tips.

 

[EddyC]

My current employer gives raises that don't even cover the yearly cost of living inflation, except for certain particular people (I can't figure out how to become one of them). I've been there for 5-1/2 years. In the most recent performance review I told them that I feel like I am working in the Soviet Union, where "You pretend to pay us & we pretend to work". I also remind them that we are supposedly an ENR 100 firm and I expect them to act accordingly. All I hear is spin in response. Whatever effort I make to learn anything or to do a good job, I do for myself as a learning experience in order to prepare myself for future employers.

 

[KENAT]

EddyC,

When I said cost of living adjustment I didn't mean it necessarily covered it, just that that was the name (or equivalent) they gave it.

If I remember the first raise I got was barely inflation, not true cost of living, but after 3 months there I Didn't want to complain. As I recall it was flat 500 stirling for all employess. A lot to some of the shop floor and less skilled employees, not much to the engineers etc.

 

[Senselessticker]

I'm in the A/E business. I have just over 2 years experience. I work well behond the scope of my "job description" especially when compared to other young engineers within the company with the same experience. I have little to no technical supervision from my boss and usually am handling 5-8 projects (ranging in duration from small 1 month tasks to 1 year designs) at a time where I control the budget for myself, designers, and CAD operators. I deal directly with clients on technical issues. I'm scheduled to take the E.I.T this fall. My yearly performance reviews have been "satisfactory" and have resulted in the 3-4% raises each year. Other than the fact that I am not liscensed...I generally do the same work as folks who have been around for 10-20 years...so the company is getting alot of bang for buck.

I approached my boss and asked for a pay grade bump (promotion). He was in agreement that I deserve a raise and offered up massive amounts of praise for my work over the last two years. However, he is saying that it may be difficult to push it through the proper approvals and that usually such a raise would occur after 3+ years experience. He was fishing for an answer (and seemed concerned) to: "what if the raise doesn't happen?" I responded that I'm am just looking for confirmation of my position/future within the company and gave no idiation that I was considering leaving. However...I have starting feeling around for other jobs.

 

[KENAT]

Senseless,

How big is your company?

Smaller companies seem to have more flexibility in pay while really big companies can be a bit more rigid.

You could do what I did. I had some want adds open on my desk when my Tech Director came around. There'd been a few cuts in other departments a week or two before and I was hedging my bets in case they decided to trim ours, it wasn't a cunning plan to get more pay. Anyway a few weeks later at the anual pay review I got a well above inflation pay rise!

 

[Senselessticker]

The A/E division of our company is composed of approximately 100 engineers, designers, CAD operators, PM's, and admin support. When considering the entire company, I'm guessing there are ~300+ employees. The company was started 10 years ago.

 

[Ashereng]

At a couple of major companies that I worked at, the first 2-3 years were pretty much the same between them, and seemed to be "boiler plated".
- 6 months raise
- 1 year raise
- 2 year raise (plus 1 more week vacation)
- 3 year raise (plus 1 more week vacation if you didn't get it at 2 years)

After that, you are on your own merits.

This is salary, not necessarily level promotion.

Many companies today actually are giving less raises, and more bonuses. This is because bonuses can be take away when times go bad, and I would think that there is less justification for HR/company to grant one, as bonuses are one time deals, given as required to keep employees.

"Do not worry about your problems with mathematics, I assure you mine are far greater."
Albert Einstein
Have you read FAQ731-376 to make the best use of Eng-Tips Forums?

 

[ewh]

I managed a good bump in rate and position when we had to hire a couple of CAD jockeys on contract (small company not used to such high rates). Being a former contractor myself, my boss was well aware that I was well aware of the rates and positions available if I chose to hit the road again. That helped cool my jets, and I am so far glad to be where I am.

 

[wes616]

Your best case senario (for the $$ that is) is to leave your company to another one at about 3 years. My wife did this (architect) she got a 60% increase in pay.



Wes C.
------------------------------
When they broke open molecules, they found they were only stuffed with atoms. But when they broke open atoms, they found them stuffed with explosions...

 

[GregLocock]

On the minus side, why are you only getting 'satisfactory' reviews when your boss gives 'massive amounts of praise' for your past performance, face to face? Perhaps he should be encouraged to add a little of that enthusiasm to your next review.

On the plus side, it sounds to me like you have a great job that you enjoy. I'd stick with it for at least another year or so, write a great resume, and find a new job. In the mean time, explicitly apply pressure for a promotion and/or raise, so that when the time comes they can't claim that they weren't informed.

Incidentally it sounds like a largeish company, you may need to figure out who actually controls pay rises, it may not be obvious.


Cheers

Greg Locock

Please see FAQ731-376 for tips on how to make the best use of Eng-Tips.

 

[AndrewTX]

That really depends not only on your industry, but also on your employer.

My first job out of university was for a company that had a very formal ranking and position grade number system. A college hire was grade 22. You progressed to grades 23 adn 24. A senior engineer was grade 25, and an engineering supervisor was grade 25 or 26.

Each grade had a written description of what you needed to know and be able to do to get to that grade. Promotions from 22 to 23 usually took about a year, after that it would be another 2 years usually to make 24. After that it was up to the evaluation of your abilities and performance.

My next company had absolutely no formal ranking or grading system. There were no formal titles or ranks other than being a designated discipline lead on a project. You would get raises, but no promotions in the traditional sense.

If your company has a formal ranking system and written descriptions, it is simply a matter of making sure your work assignments will give you the knowledge and experiece to move up the ladder.

 

[NewfieEng]

Senseless,

I think KENAT has the right approach. Here is my expereince.
In my last job I really wanted a transfer and beged and pleaded for the transfer which was the same pay and job just another location. I was the right fit for the job and was even temporarly tranfered there to do the job while they were short handed. In the end I didn't get it and when I went to quit after finding something else, my boss ofered me the transfer. It was too little to late.

There was another emplyee who wanted to tansfer to a totally different departement and area (pretty much another company), he wasn't threateneing to quit but he may as well have been since the departement was so different and separated. He talked about it and asked how he could get into that part of the company. When raises came around he got the fattest raise I have ever seen, 14% (two combined raises). To top it off the guy was a goofoff and not very good at his job or well praised by his peers. But the compnay really needed him to stay around, even if he did a bad job.

I will not say the name of the company but it is one of the largest O&G service companies in the world, with hundereds of thousands of emplyees.

And the moral of the story is if you want something (raise or transfer) you need to let your compnay know you are willing to go to extreems to get it. Or at least let them think you are.

 

[Senselessticker]

As an update with my situation...My boss has sent written request to his supervisor indicating that he would like for me to be promoted to the next paygrade/title. My boss's supervisor must convince the president of the company that I deserve a raise (its company policy that all raises must be approved by the president). It now been about 3 weeks and I've heard nothing. It's probably important to note that my boss is a very passive type who seems to have a hard time "getting his way" within the company (although he is a good engineer and is respected technically).

When meeting with my boss a few weeks ago, I made it clear that I wanted a yes/no answer concerning my raise. Yet another month has gone by and still no definitive word from above... I've not been looking *real* hard for another job, however if I do not receive the raise I plan on doing so. Should I go ahead and start feeling around for other jobs?

Once I get another offer, should I give my current employer another chance to promote me, or should I just turn in my notice and explain they've been "dragging their feet" too long and its too late to make up for it? I enjoy almost everything about my current job and do not want to leave, however I feel that I'm getting taken advantage of from a $$$ standpoint.

Thanks again for all the posts!

 

[bradpa77]

I had my first "promotion" a year after I started my first engineering job. The promotion was from "Engineer I" to "Engineer II". The difference in job description was never given to me. I didn't really have any increase in responsibility either. After 4 and a half years of experience I was promoted from "Engineer II" to "Engineer III". Once again, I never really got any official increase in responsibility. It basically was just a title change both times and they both came with raises in the ballpark of 8%. I haven't had what I consider a big promotion yet and I'm getting close to 5 years experience. Based on the other engineers at my company, I don't expect to see any other promotions for a while but I think the next one will be a management position. It seems like all the engineers here plateau at "Engineer III" until they get an offer for a management position.