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Pursue Disciplinary Action?

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KENAT

KENAT

Mechanical
Jun 12, 2006
18,387
US
An engineer here arbitrarily downloaded an updated version of our main CAD software. In doing so he converted at least one major assembly to the new version so others were unable to open it.

We’re holding off going to the newer version because we have concerns over the impact on performance on some older machines, it’s not just that we’re dragging our feet etc.

We had a file back up from a few days ago however, we did lose some work.

I’ve had minor issues with this engineer before but with a lot of tongue biting have normally got through it.

I don’t see any ethical issue with my pushing for disciplinary action against him, may make me unpopular/target for next layoffs but not unethical.

Does anyone here see an ethics issue with it?

I ask because I posted before about someone bringing up violations of procedures/policies/laws to get rid of someone that was making their life hell and several posters thought is was weaseley/shrew like etc.

Now in this case my main reason isn’t my personal feelings for the person but what he did in this particular incident, but I’d be lying if I said it wasn’t in the back of my mind.

What do you reckon?


KENAT, probably the least qualified checker you'll ever meet...
 
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I think he definitely needs his hands slapped. He (and the company) is very lucky that larger amounts of data were not lost. It is one thing to download it just to check it out, quite another to save production files so that they are rendered unusable by others in the company. Isn't there a company policy forbidding this sort of thing? If so, he should be written up.
 
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Write up an invoice tallying up they time lost ad the cost impact of that time. Do this each time Mr. Wonderful costs you time.
 
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ewh, you hit part of the problem. I don't think our policy in these areas is well defined or enforced. I seem to recal something about not having unauthorized software but not what the definition of authorized software is!

So, I'm not expecting him to get fired over this, but a good wrist slapping is I believe appropriate.

Of course he tried explaining it away to IT and a colleague as he was just trying it out and thought he'd backed up data.

I don't buy it, and apparantly the IT guy isn't convinced, said this particular engineer has done this kind of thing before to force a version upgrade.

KENAT, probably the least qualified checker you'll ever meet...
 
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The CAD police gets up in my business when i manually edit a dimension on a Not-To-Scale detail. Downloading software that corrupts active files.. that would provide grounds for non-lethal force at my office. ZAP!
 
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ZAP, if only.

KENAT, probably the least qualified checker you'll ever meet...
 
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I use Unigraphics, and have been in a similar situation as your co-worker, so I can't be too hard on him. We were trying out the newest release (NX1) and I had a huge customer supplied assembly file open. I had our part in the assembly and saved it. Unfortunately, I did not "save work part only", and the entire assembly was saved and updated. I got lucky, due to the fact that we only send out parasolid files anyway, and I was the only UG user at the time, but have since been pretty anal about securing customer files where no one can tamper with them. We now only work on copies of their files.
I realize that your situation if quite different, but post this just to show that, without proper control, these things can and do happen. Don't shoot the guy just yet, but do make it obvious that this should not have happened.
 
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Our released files are in a secure area so it wasn't one of these that was lost.

Unfortunately our in work stuff isn't really secure and it was here he screwed it up.

We've also had previous conversations with him that we want to change version but have our reasons for not doing so imediately. We also told him we plan carrying out performance testing etc. So it's not like he didn't know what was going on.

But I appreciate you playing devils advocate ewh, that's part of what I was looking for.

KENAT, probably the least qualified checker you'll ever meet...
 
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JStephen, that's what I've done with various things to date.

This time it's cost the company quite a few man hours, on a high priority project (if it fails this part of the company could go belly up) that's already behind schedule.

At what point to draw the line and say something needs to be done, but this is starting to sound more like "overcoming obstacles getting my work done" than ethics

KENAT, probably the least qualified checker you'll ever meet...
 
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1) Introduce a policy that says installing/upgrading /any/ software is a sackable offence

2) Make him sign a copy

That's closed the stable door. That is not an unusual policy by the way.

3) Ask him how he proposes to rectify the situation.







Cheers

Greg Locock

Please see FAQ731-376 for tips on how to make the best use of Eng-Tips.
 
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1 & 2, agreed the stable door may have been left ajar.

3) Conveniently he was out today so correcting the situation fell mainly on a colleague of mine plus IT since we needed it for ECO tomorrow.

KENAT, probably the least qualified checker you'll ever meet...
 
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I opened some files in SolidWorks 2007 today, just to see what was inside ... for perfectly legitimate purposes.

On closing them, I was presented with a dialog asking me if I wished to update them, and I answered 'no'.

... But when I opened some _other_ files, I got an information box telling me that the files that I thought I had already closed and left unmolested ... were being updated. I was given no opportunity to stop, abort, or circumvent that process.

It _seems_like_ the "no, don't update" response produced a _deferred_ and erroneous update, that somehow got triggered after further unrelated activity. I know zip about SolidWorks; maybe that's normal, maybe not. It doesn't _seem_ like a normal behavior.

I don't yet know if any damage was done by what is potentially a very nasty bu.... er, design feature.

It's not an auspicious start to my new job. It could happen to anyone.




Mike Halloran
Pembroke Pines, FL, USA
 
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Mike, did you go out of your way to down load a new version of Solid Works rather than using the current version installed on your machine, or the equivalent?

I agree mistakes get made, I've made plenty.

However, when you go out of your way to make the mistake happen, and it has a significant impact, isn't there some accountability?

This guy was here long before me, and until I turned up was probably the expert CAD user. Read into that what you will.

KENAT, probably the least qualified checker you'll ever meet...
 
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Mike ... are you sure SW was updating the files when opening them? Usually, when older version files are opened, SW will show a message saying that the files will be updated to the new version when saved.

BTW, congrats on the new job.

[cheers]
 
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The local software guru was just finishing up loading SW on my brand new computer when I arrived the week before last.

Since then, I've answered 'okay' to some anonymous demands to 'update' .... _something_. I have no idea what application was making the request, or what it did in response. It seemed to be the only way to make it stop nagging me. I wouldn't call that 'going out of my way'.


The way I see it, if I can't _read_ a file using a newer version of the software than that which produced it without unintentionally modifying the file, I'd call that a serious programming error, and I'd hold Solidworks accountable. I hope my boss sees it that way...



Mike Halloran
Pembroke Pines, FL, USA
 
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Mike, congrats.

In your case I think it would be unfair to hold you accountable.

For our guy, ...

Congrats on the new job by the way.

KENAT, probably the least qualified checker you'll ever meet...
 
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KENAT, I agree with you. A reasonable person would know better imo. If nothing else, engineers are not getting paid to do IT's job incorrectly and mess up things for everyone. So he's not only goofing off and not making money but actually costing money.

If it can be recovered and the person is worth saving, first offense and so on, definite punishment but probably not fired. Otherwise = canned.
 
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Whoa Mike ... If someone dropped a document on your desk and asked you to sign it, would you do so without first reading it, and understanding what you were signing? I very much doubt it; so why would you just accept to install or update some software just because it appears on your monitor?

Clicking "Yes" just to get rid of nag screens without understanding what you are agreeing to could result in the same problem that KENATs engineer caused. I'm sorry, but IMO the only difference would be negligence (or maybe lack of due diligence) versus malicious intent.

[cheers]
 
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Thanks Ucfse & CBL, I was starting to think I was over reacting.

KENAT, probably the least qualified checker you'll ever meet...
 
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