Returning to Engineering 3

[twodoorhardtop]

I have 14 years of experience in mfg. engineering with the last 2 yrs. as Dir. of Quality but left industry in 1998 to purchase a marina with a partner. It was a rare opportunity and a great management learning experience. We did well with the business and the approx. 14 employees. I sold my half to my partner to return to my roots in PA and to take care of family issues in Aug of 2002. I also have been doing some auto restoration work and taking a biology course.

In Nov. 2003, I began search for employment back in engineering thinking my business management skills would be a plus. Outside recruiters seem to recognize this but when they send my resume to companies, they are not very interested.

One of my positions nine years ago was with a medical device company. This industry was most fulfilling to me, although I have applied to any industry that matches my background. Again, I have had very little response.

I have been accepted to a university for their MSc. in Biomedical Engineering and awarded a fellowship. I want to attend but have concerns that this will not be much of a help to get back into engineering. I've been trying to contact companies for their opinion and have spoken with one so far. They didn't feel that the degree would automatically help me get into the field or guarantee a position because I would still have the issues of doing something completely different since 1998.

Any comments that will assist me in returning to engineering is appreciated. More specifically, will pursuing graduate studies in BME be a help?

 

[SLTG]

Well,

With 14 years of experience, getting master or Phd would make you very valuable college instructor.

Sltg

 

[tygerdawg]

ummmm...be careful about making any rash decisions based on your response to anything/anybody/anycompany today. The job market in the US has been in the dumper for engineers for the past couple of years. It is just now starting to show life but I think it has a very long way to go.

I got laid off a month before 9-11, decided to throw the dice and start a "consulting" business, and failed miserably after nine months because 9-11 was the catalyst for the worst recession in 30 years. When I started looking for a job there were no jobs anywhere and I have been struggling ever since doing the freelance thing. When the desperation level got high enough, I decided I'd had enough and started looking for a job.

It's like I had leaking sores and a great big "L" for "LOSER" tatooed on my forehead.

Never in my wildest dreams would I have thought that having a Master's in ME, a PE, and 23+ years of manuacturing/design/automation engineering experience would EXCLUDE me from getting a job. For two years almost EVERY manager with whom I have interviewed has been younger than I am, so there is a generational disconnect going on there. More often than not, it's apparent that these young agressive hotshots have been hired as managers because they were cheap. But because they have the title, they think they've been legitimized. Moreover, a lot of companies are still in a bunker mentality and are keeping their costs down by hiring younger engineers and pseudo-engineers and staying away from the mid-career folks like me.

Right now it's pretty tough in a lot of areas. It seems like "riding out the recession" by getting a master's degree and giving the economy a couple of years to get back on track may be a good idea. If your personal finances can support that.

And SLTG is correct, it would be a good combo for teaching....IF you could find a teaching position. Better if Ph.D., because there just aren't that many Ph.D.'s out there who aren't foreign-born.

TygerDawg

 

[Maui]

I am a Ph.D. who was born in the US. I earned my M.S. degree in Mechanical engineering in 1988 and my Ph.D. in Materials Science in 1992. The current job market is very similar to the one that I entered with my doctorate in 1992.

You may already realize that your degrees do not guarantee you anything. Your personal contacts, ingenuity, and hard work will get you much farther than anything else. If teaching at the college level is your ultimate goal, then by all means earn your Ph.D. But if that is not your goal, then skip it. In that case it isn't worth the time, effort, or cost. The Ph.D. will close more doors than it will open for you in industry. Companies may be reluctant to hire a Ph.D. in engineering for a variety of reasons. If they feel that the job at hand is not sufficiently challenging for you, you may become bored and look for another job. If you leave too soon, you will make them look as though they made a poor choice in hiring you. An M.S. or Ph.D. engineering degree will usually command a higher salary than a B.S. degree. If the job does not require an advanced degree, then why would they hire you? They can pay a newly degreed engineer much less than they would have to pay you to do the same work.

If you earn the doctorate, you will hear the following phrase from The majority of the companies that you apply to for work: "You're overqualified". You will hear this often. If you have no contacts in industry, which many new Ph.D. don't, you will have a difficult time finding that first job that is consistent with your background and qualifications.

Some of the best resources for information regarding engineering positions in a given area are the local societies. Join ASME, or ASM intwernational, or TMS, etc. and attend their local chapter meetings. This will give you the opportunity to meet other engineers currently employed in the area. Networking with such people can be a powerful tool in landing the type of work that you are seeking. Good luck.

 

[EngJW]

During 8 months of unemployment I learned that age discrimination is rampant. One of the first questions asked is what year you graduated from high school- more important than education and experience I guess? Usually head hunters will ask because they are too stupid to realize you are on to them. One company was so blatant as to tell me to hand-write my date of birth in the top right corner. Of course they could deny asking for it if ever challenged.

It is a shame that companies today do not see the value in those with experience. I think experience allows one to see more sides of an issue and to solve problems more quickly. We can also show young engineers some old tricks.

One possibility is the smaller, understaffed companies. They are less sensitive to age and are more interested in someone who can get a job done. Larger companies can be more regimented and staffed with incompetent managers who are more concerned with impressions. Also, high tech companies may be trying to present a young image.

John Woodward

 

[EngineerDave]

Joining technical organizations is great if there are some in your field of interest. ASM worked wonders for me as far as networking.

However when I obtained an MS in Biomedical Engineering, I found a lack of a similar organization in my area. Thus I still haven't obtained a job in that field and still work in metallurgy.

I really enjoyed graduate school and am working on another masters in another field. I'll post about it sometime. In any event, I agree that getting a masters isn't a guarantee of anything.

Instead of making more, I'm making approximately 30% less after my masters degree! In obtaining my masters, I was froze out of my previous company due to post 9/11 recession issues. I had to take the new job so I can emphathize with all the horror stories out there. I was out of a job for approximately 6 months, but i consider this a blessing as it allowed me to start on a second masters which appears to be a good thing.

 

[twodoorhardtop]

Thanks everyone for your help so far. All comments are very valuable.

Right now my opportunities are limited because I have been away from engineering since 1998. Also, some companies have the concern that I’ve had my own business. As Tygerdawg pointed out, today’s economy is a big factor. There are folks out there with recent relevant experience and so they will be hired first. Trouble is, if I wait for jobs to turn around, it could be a long time and will add to my hiatus from engineering. So my real question is, “Will a new MS in BME lessen these issues when a company reviews my resume?” I guess my biggest concern is that I feel like I have these two scars on my resume and wonder if a fresh degree will help alleviate them.

It certainly helps to have contacts and one plus to being back in school is that it will help to establish some.

I would enjoy manufacturing again but hope to switch to development or research. I believe a MS would aid this and the BME component would help me get into the industry I desire. Also, it appears the biomedical engineering industry prefers MS degrees more often than other industries for development positions.

I’ve always had teaching in the back of my mind and so that’s a new potential opportunity, but again, will my business experience hurt me since it wasn’t engineering related?

Engineering Dave, where are you from? Were you willing to relocate when looking for a BME position? How was your school for helping you obtain employment? What was your area of specialization? Do you think a different background such as manufacturing would have been better than yours for obtaining employment? Curious as to what your new degree will be!


Mark