Revision Control Software

[Japher]

I work for a small company and we generally do pretty well at managing our documents merely through a networked drive. Recently, however, human error has been creeping into our method and causing undesired changes to our stick documents. I debated retraining of the individual contributor of the human error but believe that this will not solve the underlying problem. Besides, as we grow, which is suspected, the problem will only grow as well.

So, what revision/version control software would you recommend?

 

[KENAT]

Take a look in forum781 as similar comes up every now and then.

Also, what do you mean by revision control software?

Are you talking about a PDM/PLM system that will manage your CAD and potentially other Engineering data, not just revisions?

Or are you talking about something more in the ERP line of things where all part numbers are tracked and revisions are controlled there. It doesn't actually control the drawing files but does tell you what rev the parts should be at?

Or something that does both?

KENAT,

Have you reminded yourself of faq731-376 recently, or taken a look at posting policies:

http://eng-tips.com/market.cfm?

What is Engineering anyway: faq1088-1484

 

[ornerynorsk]

Solidworks offers a nice vault package. We are just in the process of implementing it, looks like it will solve our rev control and document access issues, although I'm sure there will be a learning curve, as well.

 

[IRstuff]

PTC Windchill would be an example of what I think you're looking for, but I personally wouldn't recommend it. Basically, it's a document archival system, and only certain people can be given rights to manage the documents and alter them. Other users can only add new documents.

As you company grows, such a system would be compliant to ISO9001.

Alternate, even a simple web-based file server could do the job.

Obviously ,your human error guy would NOT be allowed to mess with the database.

One simple thing that you can do right now is to make the documents read only, so any other user would have to do a "Save As" to save any document to the disk.

TTFN

FAQ731-376

 

[KENAT]

Pretty much every major CAD system has some kind of associated PDM/PLM system. Many of the PDM/PLM systems claim to be able to handle any CAD systems files but in reality may struggle with some of the more esoteric file linkages that some CAD has - for instance families of parts or similar.

So the first one I'd look at would probably be whichever one is associtated with your main CAD system, though not at the complete exclusion of other possibilities.

However, untill the OP clarifies what they mean by revision control software and if relevant what CAD system they use, then we're just throwing out guesses.

KENAT,

Have you reminded yourself of faq731-376 recently, or taken a look at posting policies:

http://eng-tips.com/market.cfm?

What is Engineering anyway: faq1088-1484

 

[pennpiper]

Japher,
You wrote
"Recently, however, human error has been creeping into our method and causing undesired changes to our stick documents."

Can you please be more clear about what you mean by "undesired changes " and "stick documents"

Thank you.

 

[IRstuff]

I'm thinking he meant "stock" documents, which someone is supposed to copy and customize for their specific need, but "someone" is saving the changes back into the original document.

TTFN

FAQ731-376

 

[ewh]

Setting file permissions would be the quickest and simplest way to preserve these documents.

"Good to know you got shoes to wear when you find the floor." - [small]Robert Hunter[/small]

 

[Japher]

We use AutoCAD P&ID.

What I really need is something with a checkin/checkout type of system and an audit trail, not just for AutoCAD files but all of our documents that will eventually see the client. I can't just cut the person off who is causing the problems, if I do that they won't be able to do anything and I might as well get rid of them. However, if I had an audit trail, a revision system, and could unroll their mistakes I would have not only a way to fix the problem but accountability for the problems (which may lead to getting rid of them).

The problem is this person will make changes to documents without first changing the file name, so all old information is written over. I have a pretty good written procedure that they have been made aware of, but they refuse or are incapable of following it. I really don't think they understand computers well enough to be using one.

The web based server system looks promising for now. I will also look at solids work

 

[IRstuff]

But you should be able to simply set the file or folder permissions on this one user to prevent him from writing over the file or the folder.

TTFN

FAQ731-376

 

[Japher]

For hundreds of files? Every time we make a new file? Seems like nuisance. Anyway, I just had to tell them again not right over files. I need a breather.

 

[Japher]

By Stick I mean working file. If we need to change one component of an equipment spec the older guys will redline and give it to this guy who makes the change. Unfortunately, if we want to change it back we don't know what to change it back to because they didn't bother to save a Void copy or update the document. We only update it as a revision if we issue the document to the client. So, half the time this person will save the document else where, work on it, and save it over the document in the working file... Unfortunately, there could be weeks between them "checking out" the file and "checking in", in which time other changes may have occurred.

It's really very frustrating to see a transmittal go out only to see the documents sent are not the right ones.

 

[Yagonyonok]

Japher,

Since you are working with an AutoCAD package have you looked at the AutoDesk data management server? I haven't used AutoCAD P&ID, so I don't know for sure if it will work with ADMS or not, but if it does it will have all the features that you are describing.

I use it with Inventor. It keeps track of who has what checked out, (and warns you if you try to edit something that is checked out to someone else), keeps old revisions (and who made them) and allows you to restore them.

It may be worth looking into. If it works it should solve your problem.

 

[ctopher]

Autodesk Vault and SolidWorks PDMWorks will work nicely.
Also check into DBWorks.

Chris
SolidWorks 08, CATIA V5
ctopher's home (updated Aug 5, 2008)
ctopher's blog
SolidWorks Legion

 

[nrostrander]

Just my two cents,

From an ISO Rep point of view, I would have to say that you first need to look into your companies requirements for controls. Just purchasing a PDM program is not the best method to the madness.

First thing you would need to do is analyze and document all your current processes as is. The next step would be to perform a gap analysis upon your processes and correct any errors to which you discover. Only then can you truly know what PDM system will work for your specific set of internal, and external, requirements. Might I suggest that you get a copy of the ISO9000 spec? I am not telling you that your company needs to become compliant, just utilize the knowledge in has to offer in regards to revision control of quality documents and data.

The next step to take would be to create and present a presentation to your top-management showing them you’re found data supporting your need for a PDM system. Just be sure that you fully analyze multiple systems and have the company reps of the aforementioned programs, relate the system to your specific need. Every company is different, thus no one system that works of company A will work for company B.

Though for recommendation purposes only, for Autodesk product users, I recommend Autodesk Vault Manufacturing. I have personally used Vault for a few years, but as our company expands to multiple locations across the US, we needed to upgrade to the Manufacturing version to allow multi-site collaboration.

Good luck on your long hard endeavor.

The following site is a great source for quality control and documentation questions and assistance. This is more-or-less a quality and revision control issue.
(

http://elsmar.com/

)

V/R
Nathan
CAD Technician/ISO Director
Compass Systems, Inc. (

http://www.compass-sys-inc.com/

)

 

[Japher]

We are a company of 4.

I spent the last 10 years working in the pharmaceutical/biotech industry where I spent a lot of time designing centralized change control procedures a lot stricter than ISO 9000. For doc control we used proprietary systems and had qualified, intelligent people who served as doc control specialists.

Unfortunately for us we don't have the funds we need to handle these documents the way I would like, and the person who is suppose to act as the "doc control specialist" is the one screwing everything up. They are highly untrainable.

Anyway, I am well aware of our needs, hence my question.

 

[KENAT]

We have a variation on the old 'write protected' network folder system.

Essentially once something is 'released' it is put into a read only folder by one of about 2 people (plus IT in case of emergency) with write access.

To make a change you have to copy it out and to put it back in it has to be the next rev.

We have an ECO system etc. to back this up but from a file point of view that pretty much summarizes it.

KENAT,

Have you reminded yourself of faq731-376 recently, or taken a look at posting policies:

http://eng-tips.com/market.cfm?

What is Engineering anyway: faq1088-1484

 

[ewh]

Pretty much the same here as KENAT... but I think that the OP wants the ability to revise files between "official" revisions.

"Good to know you got shoes to wear when you find the floor." - [small]Robert Hunter[/small]

 

[FreddyNurk]

An option out of left field that can be used to manage such issues is SubVersion. Its an open source package that has been developed for use in software development, but it can be applied to other documents including drawings.

Having said that, you'll need someone keen enough to set the system up to start with, and then you'll need to manage your users, as the interface isn't quite as friendly as one might like, given that its target user group isn't what you have. SubVersion supports a merging system for text based files, which won't work on binary file formats, so you'll need to play with it to get the file locking working too.

i'm a big fan of it as it provides the audit trail that you're chasing, it won't stop people from dumping rubbish into the storage area, but it does track everything so that you can recover / revert if necessary.

Nrostrander is right though, you need to think of what you require and how to implement it before you go down this path.