Working in a family-run-business 18

[flamby]

I am working with an engineering design cum construction company run by a family. As I grow in age and experience, I am gathering the feeling that The Family is more comfortable dealing with mediocre types as against the more technical and professional people. Almost all, without exception, in the top rung are those who are considered "loyal" to the company because they never tried to change their job. The actual reason is obvious, they were sure not to find one, if they tried.

I think, this is high time I try changing my job, even if means taking a pay cut. I do not see much growth over here. Does it make sense? How many of you can take the risk of accepting lesser pay to work in a different place where, probably, it attracts more value?

Regards.

 

[patdaly]

I take it you are not part of the Family? If so, yes, I would start looking.
I worked in a similar situation, only where the President kept nincompoops around to keep his job. I couldnt leave fast enough, and quite to my surprise, quite a bit higher salary.

 

[COKA]

The most important thing for me is to be happy with my job. Just recently there was restructuring in my company, where some people from management were layed off and those that stayed got a 10% pay cut. Not fun, let me tell you. But why did I stay? Because every morning when I wake up, I am happy to go to work, and I feel blessed to feel that way. I go to work because I want to, and not because I have to, and trust me, it makes a big difference.
So you are having second thoughts about your job? Look for another. What do you have to lose? Nobody has to know that you are looking, and if you are not 100% sure that the potential new job is what you want, then you don't have to take it. You are having second thoughts, therefore there is something that is stopping you from being 100% happy. Give it a try, you have nothing to lose!

Coka

 

[jmw]

For most of us, we have to work, whether we want to or not. However, in these fora you will find a very high percentage of people who love what they do or can do and would work even if they got no pay.

On the one hand such an attitude leads to exploitation, work becomes more of a vocation than anything else (see the thread on Engineers pay Vs Plumbers etc)

There again, no one says you shouldn't enjoy your work or the environment or the people you work with or for.
We may all have to put up with some things we rather change but not being able to enjoy your work isn't one of them.
If you are not happy, start looking.
Put job satisfaction and enjoyment at the top of the list, figure out what are the things you like best in one list and the things you don't like on the other side of the page and then look for a job that maximises the plus factors and minimises the minus.
If you keep the job you have while you look, it enables you to look without being pressured. You can pick and choose.

For some one with no job, having a job is the only real item on the list but it should have the caveat that it is a bill-paying job that let's you take a more careful look for your ideal job, gives you experience, keeps your skills fresh and honed.

You may find that findng a company that matches you criteria is tough but many here have decided the best employer is themselves; and some may also have found they are their own worst employer and are happeier working for someone else. Be clear which type you are, false illusions are no help.

JMW

http://www.viscoanalyser.com

 

[MarauderX]

I have that feeling that the more charismatic types go farther faster in the family businesses, even if they are screw-ups. If that's not you, or it can't become you, then your best bet may be to move on. Sure they value loyalty, who doesn't really, and you might want to explain your situation after you brought in a case of donuts and told them the latest joke you heard. Perhaps they will reconsider the amount of effort and money you bring in for them and they will bump you up in the future. Or you could walk in with another offer already and tell them that you aren't really considering it, but it shows them that someone else also values your abilities. The trick is not to play politics so much as be open with what you want and when you want it. They probably don't know; you might have to tell them directly, but keep it easy-going as not to stress them out - after all they are a family business, so they probably take work-worries home with them more often than you might think.

 

[onlyadrafter]

Hello,

Nepotism and being part of the 'in-crowd' will always get you further than being 'him/her over there'.

Good luck in your new position.



----------------------------------
Hope this helps.
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maybe only a drafter
but the best user at this company!

 

[strokersix]

I'll offer a couple comments from my experience working in a family owned and run business:

I was hired to be a tool room/production supervisor in a small machine shop and metal stamping operation. While it was overall a decent working environment, I became increasingly frustrated when my attempts to improve operations were repeatedly vetoed by the owner. It seemed almost as if the owner took my attempts to change things for the better as a personal attack on him.

My point is that in a family run business, the owner has high personal stakes in the operation and in my experience that made for a difficult situation.

flame: It sounds to me like your situation may be somewhat similar in that the leadership chooses mediocre employees to eliminate challenge to their authority or way of doing things.

 

[TheTick]

humming Paul Simon tune...

"...my lack of education hasn't hurt me none.
I can read the writing on the wall..."

 

[PSE]

flame,

Regardless of whether the company is family owned or not, you are the one in charge of your own career. Depending upon your goals, you need to determine whether it is worth moving on or staying. Are you concerned with the company's growth or your own? With work experience under your belt it is likely that you would be able to negotiate at least an equivalent salary/benefits package with other employers. The choice is ultimately yours.

Regards

 

[funnelguy]

I have worked for 3 family owned/run companies and am currently self-employed.

Loyalty is the number one factor in appraising an employee. Period. Anyone who is not loyal could or will hurt the business (and consequently, family) by pursuing their own self-interests.

Family interests will be protected at the expense of profits. The business exists to provide the owner and owner's family with a living. You should expect to see brothers or wives or children in positions they are not qualified for making more money than the position would otherwise pay. There are valid tax reasons for this in addition to the protection of family.

Now for the other side of the coin. Open your eyes a bit and see the rest of the story. I have also worked for large corporations. Never have I seen more non-productive employees than when I worked for the big guys. The large companies I worked for had scores of people who raised avoidance of work to an artform.

The next point I would make is a sensitive one on this forum. Technical prowess does not guarantee success. Being supremely qualified is of no interest to a closely held company if you are going to leave in a couple of years and take their knowledge and customers with you. Is that really so hard to understand? Also, there have been precious few times in my career when the most elegant, technical solution was the best one. Practicality and cost effectiveness generally rule the roost, especially within the small business community. It's all about the money.

The most positive aspect of working for a family run business I have seen is their devotion to their workers. I have seen owners really go out of their way to assist trusted employees in times of trouble. I have seen non-related employees given the run of the corporation after the owners determined they were trustworthy. The owners want their companies to do well, they just don't want to be in the business of propagating competition.

You should absolutely leave if you can't put your own interests second to the company's and be a permanent part of a larger team. That's what the owner is looking for in an employee.

Your days are numbered if they find out you are shopping around for a new job. Loyalty again. Argue your case on it's merits. Don't threaten the owner with a counteroffer. You take a man's money, you ride for the brand.

Many of these family owned businesses fail after ownership is transferred to other family members. I think competetive wages and future management transferral are valid topics of discussion. Perhaps a sit down after hours meeting with the owner and his legal counsel is in order IF you are an honorable sort who may want to make a real difference in this small organization.

 

[Lorentz]

I gave you a star for your last post funnelguy. When you say that:

"Loyalty is the number one factor in appraising an employee. Period."

you are speaking the truth for ALL companies no matter what their size. Every young engineer should read your post before going out into the work world.

Also, nepotism exists in ALL organizations. At least in a family owned business it is out in the open and you can decide in advance whether you can live with it or not.

 

[jmw]

Loyalty should be a two way street.

JMW

http://www.viscoanalyser.com

 

[IRstuff]

But it's not a two-way relationship.

I work FOR someone, not WITH.

They buy my loyalty by the pound because they pay me to look out for their interests.

You take a man's money, you ride for the brand.

If I can't honestly do that, then I don't belong there.

But that's the business loyalty. I will not let my company interests override my own best interests. It's not worth the cost. At the end of the day, I will not regret not spending more time at work.

TTFN

 

[GregLocock]

""Loyalty is the number one factor in appraising an employee. Period."

you are speaking the truth for ALL companies no matter what their size. "


Lorentz, do you seriously rate loyalty ahead of truthfulness, integrity, ability, experience etc etc?

How bizarre. Can my dog come and work for you, he is very loyal? I hope you will pay him a lot.





Cheers

Greg Locock

 

[Lorentz]

Hi Greg Locock

Do I rate loyalty ahead of the qualities you list? What does it matter what I put first? I'm saying that every employer I have ever had or heard of puts it first. Loyalty alone is not enough to guarantee employment, but if loyalty is suspect unemployment will soon follow.

 

[funnelguy]

jmw and IRstuff,
I absolutely agree with both of you. Large companies are less likely to be "loyal", IMO. Quite often the cuts made at large corporations are a simple percentage cut based on years of service. Only the truly exceptional might escape this form of management cowardice. Such has been my experience, anyway. I prefer to work for small, agressive, privately held companies.

Greg,
Again, I am only relating my experiences. The really gifted engineers I have known all value their technical prowess over the health and security of their company. No judgements here, I think the gifted would have to look at their career in that manner just to stay on top of their game. The problem then becomes how do you hire an uber-engineer and retain sole ownership of their technical abilities? What if your organization doesn't need that level of technical prowess? I've had gifted machinists demand toolmaker training and wages because they felt they were capable. A couple of them were, but I didn't need toolmakers. They could leave or continue as they were. But heaven help them if they sold out my customer list or methods.

Lorentz,
I left the big corporations and never looked back when I discovered how inflexible and unfair their human resources departments were. I still "work" for them, but I decide the terms through bidding. Not some arbitrary set of guidelines based on anything but my abilities. The big guys burned a few bridges, IMO, and need to re-examine their treatment of employees (not just engineers) as commodities.

 

[flamby]

Thanks all for the excellent posts.

I need to define the term "loyal" first in the context I have used it. Anybody selling the secrets is obviously unpardonable, and this is not what I wish to discuss.

My employer means to identify those who will stick to the company, no matter what the company pays them or asks them to do, and these people are the loyalists. Merit, capabilities, truthfulness are no criteria. Yesman-ship is highly desirable. [joke] eg Greg's dog [/joke]

This is in fact no-quality per se. It is a perception of others of you. More able you are to find jobs, more disloyal you may be seen as as the family wants to control you and knows you are a powerful dog and can break the leash someday. In this situation, I see how one's strengths become one's disloyalty.

To me loyalty is to work for my employer honestly and to the best of my talents and capabilities. Thus I am loyal in my own perception. And yes. I need to be looked after well and heard. Just one "loyal" whispering in the ears of employer will generate more ripples than my shouting.

Yes, TheTick, I read it on the wall. But jmw's first post -I found it very balanced. If I ignore the future worries that where I would be after a few years, I really love my job and enjoy it.

funnelguy, yes, its all about money. But it pains me to see that family people spoiling too much money, where a simple solution could work. They heed the non-pro loyalist's advice and do not ask me! THIS is what I take as real insult. Otherwise, they pay me good. My fear is, I will become one of those some day!!

Regards.

 

[funnelguy]

Good discussion! Another caveat for my observations would be that I am an American, and my observations are my own and could certainly be wrongheaded when applied in other countries or cultures. Now, having said that...

Quote,"My employer means to identify those who will stick to the company, no matter what the company pays them or asks them to do, and these people are the loyalists. Merit, capabilities, truthfulness are no criteria. Yesman-ship is highly desirable.

Your employer is a fool who will ultimately have his/her head handed to them in a competetive marketplace, IMO. Who was it that said they didn't need to hire someone with the same opinions as them? Sorry, can't remember. Anyway, Flame, I went back a few threads and found that you are in India. I really have no idea about business culture in India. Please remember I am from America, and come from a manufacturing background as well. Good luck with your dilemma.

 

[plasgears]

The worst case of a family owned business was when two brothers/owners had a falling out. The older idiot brother set the stage for starting a competing company. He hired away some key employees, and that's when the sparks started flying.

It's really a complicated story, but in the end the idiot brother and his immediate family entourage was ejected and sued. I left when I saw the telltale signs. The idiot brother had also hired "spoilers" in the staff to help disperse the company talent. That's when I decided to leave.

 

[rmw]

I have worked for more than one family oriented businesses, and have come to one conclusion that governs my actions and attitude about working there. Rule #1, FAMILY COMES FIRST (caps for shouting). Rule #2, FAMILY COMES FIRST.

So, no matter what your qualifications, loyalty level, contribution, position, etc., if someone in the family (nephew, bro-in-law, son, you fill in the blanks,) needs something, anything, promotion, position, plum assignment, good project, whatever, you, the non-family member will be second in line for consideration.

Especially if the relative is the person of responsibilities' bro-in-law, or other close in-law, because no owner, manager, etc., is going to take a position in any dispute on the side of the non-family member against the close relative of the person he/she sleeps with.

If you keep that in mind at all times, and watch your backside, you can do quite well in family businesses. My experiences were generally good.

rmw