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Penetrating containment wall around hydrocarbon tankage?

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11echo

11echo

Petroleum
Jun 4, 2002
444
I'm working on a project where the engineers want me to penetrate the masonry containment wall of a diesel with a fill line. Now if this was a dirt berm type containment wall I know we can't do that ...could compromise the integrity in an earthquake. BUT I don't know if this holds true with a masonry wall? The engineers (young, REAL young) say "No Problem" but I have that gut feeling.
Can anybody give me some direction on this?
 
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For a pipe penetration through a masonary wall (I'm assuming reinforced concrete), you can put a sleeve larger than the pipe through the wall, with the pipe inside the sleeve and an expandable rubber seal to fill the gap and allow for some motion. We just completed a 20 inch pipe penetration this way and it looks good!
 
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I've done similar type penetrations doing that exact same type of design. BUT this is a diesel tank and if a catastrophic failure does occur, diesel will be 3ft deep in this containment area ...and this penetration will be under the surface at 1'-6" elev. So a rubber seal may or may not work, however this masonry wall is only 8" wide so trying to “cast” this pipe sleeve in the wall would be a problem, this project is in a seismic zone 4, and ambient temps get up to 130F.
My basic gut feeling is still to go over the wall or under it.
 
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What's the problem with going over the wall,is it too high?
 
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Wall is 5ft; I could do that, but not a "clean" way to do it ascetically. Actually I would prefer to go underground. Only problem with that is trying to get clear of containment wall footing.
 
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SO nobody has a problem with this tank rocking-n-rolling in a zone 4 earth quake with 20ft section of fill line sticking thru the containment wall? Seems to me it would be pretty easy for that tank catastrophically fail and pull that fill line thru or knock a hole or section of the wall down!!? ...OR have I been watching too many movies? *G*
 
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What´s he aestetical problem with a beautiful pipe running over the wall?
You can always paint it artistical,
whatever.

 
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If I were project owner I think I would like the wall and the piece of pipe to be
1 safe
2 functional
3 cheap
4
5
6
.
.
.
.
9999 pretty
 
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If the wall is designed for seismic loads, the tank is designed for seismic loads, the tank foundation is designed for seismic loads, and the pipe has adequate flexibility, the tank should not pull the wall down with the pipe, nor should the wall fall. Is it designed for seismic loads or not? If yes to all the above, I have no problem.

 
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This diesel tank is a 5000BBL API650 with external rafters, they are still working on the foundation, and the containment wall is designed per seismic zone 4. The fill line is 4” dia. and about 20ft. long and runs straight from the tank and thru the containment wall ...and is setting on one support about 3ft from the tank wall. It's NOT designed to flex any way! …And that's how the design looks now.
So do you think I need to continue to be worried?
 
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No worries. The seal will allow the 4" to slide. The 4" will bend, but probably not fail, during vertical seismic motions. The 4" pipe will buckle if any compressive load is introduced and maybe some deformation of the nozzle and tank shell might occur, if somehow a tension load develops. Is it possible to develop any axial loads in the 4" pipe? Probably not, if you have a 90 bend somewhere between the tank and wherever the pipe goes. If the tank fails, you have the wall, and if the 4" flange bolts break, you might at worse have some diesel flowing out of the 4" pipe.

 
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API 2610 7.2.9 (1994 version - I know, it is the old version. I will get the newer one someday) says piping passing through the dike wall shall be designed to prevent build up of stresses during settlement. Would this provision cover the stresses generated during a quake? If not, I think it should be demonstrated that the quake stresses can indeed be absorbed. That particular API does not explicitly mention earthquake.

That sleeve is not just a sleeve. Fire resistant, etc.
 
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Thanks BigI. I have never read the B31.3 from cover to cover. Always when I needed something I tried to pin point it somehow. (I am into risk analysis and not actual design.)I will try to check that section out.
 
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I'll save you the trouble of reading B 31.3 cover to cover...

Among other loads and forces described in the same pp 301 appear.. Earthquake and Movements

301.5.3 Earthquake. Piping shall be designed for
earthquake-induced horizontal forces. The method of
analysis may be as described in ASCE 7 or the Uniform
Building Code.

301.8 Effects of Support, Anchor, and Terminal
Movements
The effects of movements of piping supports, anchors,
and connected equipment shall be taken into account
in the design of piping. These movements may result
from the flexibility and/or thermal expansion of equipment,
supports, or anchors; and from settlement, tidal
movements, or wind sway.

 
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