2 dead in Tesla accident "Noone wasdrivingthe car" 15

[MartinLe]

https://www.click2houston.com/news/...er-fiery-tesla-crash-in-spring-officials-say/

“no one was driving” the fully-electric 2019 Tesla when the accident happened. There was a person in the passenger seat of the front of the car and in the rear passenger seat of the car.

the vehicle was traveling at a high speed when it failed to negotiate a cul-de-sac turn, ran off the road and hit the tree.

The brother-in-law of one of the victims said relatives watched the car burn for four hours as authorities tried to tap out the flames.

Authorities said they used 32,000 gallons of water to extinguish the flames because the vehicle’s batteries kept reigniting. At one point, Herman said, deputies had to call Tesla to ask them how to put out the fire in the battery.

 

[RedSnake]

When you drive in the winter, you spend significant time and effort cleaning windows.

And even more in the autumn and spring..

“Logic will get you from A to Z; imagination will get you everywhere.“
Albert Einstein

 

[Demented]

It's not a rotating, self-cleaning screen... it's a clear tape that sits across the lens, and tape length is (obviously) limited. The tape is replaced after every race. I wrote the firmware that (among other things) controls the tape-winding stepper motor (Broadcast Sports designs/manufactures the vast majority of camera systems used in sporting events, like Nascar, F-1, etc..

There are rotating dome lens cameras on the market and in use in motorsports. Probably more cylindrical glass lens ones, but I've production machined gears that went to a self cleaning rotating lens gyroscopic camera. The heavy machinery world is full of rotating lens self cleaning back-up cameras too.
The tech is there and it does work.

Precision guess work based on information provided by those of questionable knowledge

 

[FacEngrPE]

Clear View Screens
Auto stylists will never go for this, and the 60W motor will bother the efficiency croud, particularly if several are needed to protect all of the sensors.

 

[spsalso]

Maybe it'll be smaller.

Hey, you could make it a way-cool styling element. It's not a problem; it's an opportunity!


spsalso

 

[BrianPetersen]

https://toronto.citynews.ca/2021/12/16/wave-shuttle-whitby-durham-region-transit-traffic/

 

[spsalso]

So the person on board the autonomous shuttle was there to take control if the thing screwed up. The thing screwed up. The person apparently did NOT take control. It crashed. The person was critically injured.

Imagine a job where you are supposed to be constantly alert for problems that almost never happen.

I had one something like that once, and it is torture. You've got all the responsibility, and none of the control.

They would have been better having the person drive the damn bus.


spsalso

 

[BrianPetersen]

That's precisely the problem as I understand it.

That shuttle has a pre-programmed route, which makes that situation even worse!

 

[Lou Scannon]

Imagine a job where you are supposed to be constantly alert for problems that almost never happen.

I had one something like that once, and it is torture. You've got all the responsibility, and none of the control.

I'd call that criminal negligence on the part of any employer that gave an employee such responsibility on an operation that could potentially injure or kill somebody.

"Schiefgehen wird, was schiefgehen kann" - das Murphygesetz

 

[TugboatEng]

It doesn't look like the collision was very severe. Two questions, was the operator properly restrained? Is the vehicle built to road vehicle crash standards?

 

[BrianPetersen]

I found this promotional video ... it's only been operational for a month!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RqONXHLt9P4

No sign of seat belts. No sign of even a driver's seat. It's not even readily apparent how an operator is supposed to take control of it if something goes amiss. Obviously there's a screen, it's probably a touchscreen, and I suppose the idea is that the operator is supposed to operate the vehicle with that if it gets in trouble. Although it has a license plate, it is certainly not built to the same set of CMVSS that apply to normal road vehicles. Public-transport vehicles (buses) ordinarily don't have seat belts for the passenger - not even buses of the airport-shuttle variety.

Evidently it's capable of 40 km/h, although they're only operating it at 25 km/h according to the video.

I was soooo tempted to put a smartypants comment on that promotional video, but I resisted. I'm sure someone else will find it.

 

[RedSnake]

It does have seatbelts.

I guess this one is for the "driver"

Whether anyone will use them or not is a different question.

And having a "driver" standing all the time while overseeing this thing, don't make it easier.



“Logic will get you from A to Z; imagination will get you everywhere.“
Albert Einstein

 

[BrianPetersen]

I stand corrected. Good eye. It has functionally useless seatbelts.

Also, from another source, I stand corrected on how long it has been in service. Apparently, 10 days.

The crash was under investigation with the road closed for many hours. Given that this was effectively a workplace and a worker got injured, the Ministry of Labour was involved. Hopefully this puts autonomous vehicles under a lot more scrutiny.

 

[RedSnake]

For 30 km/h I guess they are better then nothing, but I suspect no one will use them, maybe the "overseer" if he/she has half a "brain" will use it even though it looks more like something that meant to not throw you to the floor if something happens.

For local busses I don't think anyone uses seatbelts even if they are avalibul.
I think for school busses and intercity buses there usually are seatbelts and they try to make everybody use them too, not sure it is legal requirement though.

“Logic will get you from A to Z; imagination will get you everywhere.“
Albert Einstein

 

[MacGyverS2000]

Never seen a seatbelt on a metro rail system, though I can't say I've seen many (Boston, D.C., maybe a couple of others).

Dan - Owner

http://www.Hi-TecDesigns.com

 

[BrianPetersen]

No seat belts on buses here...but this vehicle has a passenger-vehicle license plate on it. Buses are supposed to have commercial or truck plates. If it's registered as passenger, it has to have seat belts for everyone and you have to use them. Those seat belts look like they exist so that someone can put a checkmark in a checkbox on a checklist, not to provide much actual occupant protection.

 

[LittleInch]

This is exactly the same issue that Uber or google had when their self driving car mowed some poor woman down who was crossing the road with her bicycle and the car ignored her.

Basically the person supposedly monitoring it just goes into what they call "low arousal"- basically half asleep - and can't react in time by the time they realise that the machine hasn't seen the person / tree they've hit the thing.

Remember - More details = better answers
Also: If you get a response it's polite to respond to it.

 

[drawoh]

BrianPetersen,

I am an organiser with a ski club, and I ride regularly on luxury buses. The drivers put on seatbelts when they drive. There are passenger seatbelts, but nobody puts them on. On a ski club bus trip, people wander up and down the aisles. On a trip to the airport, maybe people use seatbelts.

--
JHG

 

[BrianPetersen]

True enough, some buses have seat belts. This one had them, but I can't see how they're going to be useful.

If someone on board is not wearing their seat belt, who gets the ticket? The driver? LOL

 

[Sparweb]

How many of you have actually been in the situation where you have to realize the "other guy" approaching the intersection isn't going to stop, and will hit you if you don't stop? If you haven't experienced this, you won't understand how brief those 2 seconds are. 1 second at highway speed.

 

[itsmoked]

Had an experience with that last Saturday night.

About midnite my wife and I were driving down a street going about 20mph. I noted a car ahead on the right in a driveway ready to pull out. Waiting for me to pass I assumed, thinking no more about it. When I was no more than a car length and a half from them they abruptly pulled out!!! I've never in 40 plus years heard my wife scream before. She did this time! With no oncoming traffic I cut left for the far side curb -violently-. I never took my foot off the gas pedal. The other driver was clearly going for a crossing left turn but must've seen me at the last second and nailed their brakes. They missed my wife's door by an inch. We didn't collide and I never saw the car again as I was more interested in my wife's state-of-mind and returning to our lane. I'm betting all the bacteria on the side of my car were crushed.

I'd noticed that the car was on the other side of a short hedge ~2ft and a sign, sort of like a house-for-sale sign, and white Christmas lights on the sign or maybe the hedge. They probably didn't see us because of all those white Christmas lights and they probably had cellphone poisoning to boot.

Keith Cress
kcress -

http://www.flaminsystems.com