2007 Section VIII, Div2, Annex 5.A question-- App. B1? 1

[CRMagruder]

In 5.A.1 Scope, the paragraph referrs to stress limits in Appendix B1. Appendix B1 is refferenced again in 5.A.3 c).

Where is this Appendix B1? Is it in Section II-D?

Thanks in advance,

Chuck

 

[CRMagruder]

I'm looking at the 2007 Edition. Annex 3.B is titled "Requirements for Material Procurement (Currently Not Used).

Annex 3.A is tilted "Allowable Design Stresses (Normative)". This section lists allowable materials and referrs to Section II-D, tables 5A and 5B for allowable stresses.

Could the B1 reference in 5.A.1 be a typo?

 

[gr2vessels]

CRMagruder,
I was unable to make sense of the B1 and I tend to agree that is a typo. However, what is the correct reference then, I could not work it out, probably the B1 is just blinding me. I suggest you, perhaps to ask /post again in the Compress group, they might get us an answer.
cheers,
gr2vessels

 

[TGS4]

The paragraph in Part 5 which directs you to Annex 5.A is 5.2.2.3. I suspect that is what should be in the Scope paragraph. However, this is definitely more than an errata and should be dealt with through ASME. I recommend that you send a letter to the secretary of SubCommittee VIII asking for clarification. His contact info is:
Steven J. Rossi
The American Society of Mechanical Engineers
Three Park Avenue
New York, NY 10016
Phone: (212) 591-7522
Fax: (212) 591-8501
rossisj@asme.org

 

[CRMagruder]

Thanks TGS4,

I will do this. I have written the Secretary before asking for an interpretation using the format that is given in all of the Code Sections. This inquiry for clarification does not fit the format for interpretations or code cases.

In your opinion, may I write to the secretary with my point of inquiry without the format that results in a yes or no answer? I'm looking for the correct reference to the stress limits.

Paragraph 5.2.2.3 refers to the stress limits defined in 5.2.2.4. Am I correct that you are thinking that the "appendix B1" in Annex 5.A should be referring back to 5.2.2.3--> 5.2.2.4?

 

[TGS4]

Yes, I think that would be fine. Probably the best would be to address it simply to request that a BC-number be opened to clarify your issue. I suspect that there are a number of similar issues as we work our way through the new Div. 2.

Good catch and I hope that everything with the new Div. 2 is working out for you. You've got some good resources here on eng-tips for the new Div. 2, so don't be afraid to ask your questions.

 

[jte]

Folks-

When I'm having issues understanding the new Div. 2 Part 5, I find it very useful to go to the source: API-579 / ASME FFS-1 2007 Annex B1 etc.

Div. 2 Part 5 correlates to FFS Appendix B1; Div. 2 Annex 5.A correlates to FFS Annex B2. So when I see Div. 2 refer to "Appendix B1" and it does not make sense, but FFS refers to "Annex B1", then I'll call it a typo and realize that the intent is for the reference to be "Part 5." You really have to have both documents open and flip the pages together for things to align...

I'll second TGS4's reccomendation to contact the Secretary. Don't get too hung up on protocol and formatting issues.

jt

 

[CRMagruder]

Thanks for the background jte.

I submitted a request for clarification to the S/VIII secretary. I have been working with Div 1 for a couple of years and am trying to learn my way around Div 2, so I had no idea that Annex 5.A had its origins in another Code.

Is there more detail & discussion in API-579 / ASME FFS-1 2007? Does it make sense to buy the other spec or do I have everything in Div. 2 Part 5?

I plan to take the ASME training course later this year taught by Kam Mokhtarian. Can you recommend any books or other resources that discuss Design by Analysis procedures listed in Div. 2 Part 5?

Thanks again for your input.

CR

 

[CRMagruder]

I just got an e-mail from Steven Rossi.

This has already been opened as BC07-1709, and will be revised in the 2008 Addenda.

The correct reference should be paragraph 5.2.2.

CR

 

[jte]

CR-

Whether or not you buy a copy of API-579 / ASME FFS-1 depends on a lot of details. You state that you are familiar with Div. 1 and are just getting started with Div. 2. Welcome to the club, nobody has much experience with the all new 2007 edition of Div. 2. What kind of business are you in? I would suggest that an Engineering and Consulting or Owner/User firm get a copy of the FFS standard. I don't think that the FFS standard would add a lot of value to a fabricator. As to whether or not the FFS standard adds to Div. 2: No, about 97% of the words, sentences, and paragraph structure is identical for the "analysis" sections. No surprise there, given that both books were developed / written by the same folks. That's why it is useful to have both when a question comes up with Div. 2 - chances are it is a copy and paste error, with a reference that was supposed to be changed but wasn't. I don't think that there are any books out yet dealing directly with the new Div. 2. It's basically uncharted territory. The ASME PVP conferences have published some background papers which may provide insight. You can do a search at

http://store.asme.org/

jt