am I being shafted? 1

[oneintheeye]

this is probably not a new complaint but I have become aware of some information. My experience is approx 9 years after graduation. I am a chartered engineer (UK) which I got middle of last year. Some of that time, approx 2 and a half years was spent on site. The rest is in a design office. I currently work in design (civil/structural consultancy).

The info I have come across shows me I am paid £1500 more than the fresh wave of graduates coming into the company. I believe on a exchange rate of 1.6 at mo thats $2400 US dollars. Opinions? At the moment I'm thinking what am I doing here.

 

[SomptingGuy]

That's par for the course. If you stay with employer #1, the newbies will catch up and eventually overtake you. I'm surprised it's taken that long.

- Steve

 

[oneintheeye]

well I've been here only 4 of those years. I'm not comparing my starting salary with them. I am professionally qualified, I run projects, attand start up meetings, deal with site issues, prepare fee proposals. What would a starter do by comparision?

 

[rbulsara]

As Steve eluded, if you want to find out and realize (earn) your worth, look for another employment and go through some interviews. Staying at the same place does not work, and complaining about the raise is even more useless.



Rafiq Bulsara

http://www.srengineersct.com

 

[kelowna]

Three or four previous lives ago I lived and worked in the UK

The ICE publishes salary review papers. I know because I saw one reciently on line at the NCEplus magazine website. I would suggest you get hold of it and compare your salary with the levels shown on the paper.

 

[oneintheeye]

ues they do but to be honest most people know them to be a joke. The salaries do not accuratly reflect the majority of members. For instance a CEng could be a humble designer or a director, there is no distintion. It is flawed in many ways, although I accept it to be difficult to collate all info to please everyone. I believe they also display it in such a way to make the pay and satisfaction look good to 'promote' the industry.

 

[TPL]

£1500/month or £1500/year?

 

[oneintheeye]

per year! def per year!

 

[Ussuri]

If this helps. When I started my engineering career, probably a year or two before you I started on £15700 with a major UK consultancy (one of the top three or four). I got my CEng in 2004, having been with the same company since I graduated. After that my pay was £25000 plus a profit share of another £2000. At which point the graduates were starting on around £22000/23000 I think. So not too far different. At that time the associate directors were on maybe £35000, with local directors on maybe £45000 (head office directors were on six figures). These were usually folk in their fifties. So I could see, in real terms, what my salary would increase to over the period of 20-25 years. At which point I changed industry to Oil and Gas.

 

[oneintheeye]

well I know rough figures (range) of others in my office and its not as bad as your old place. Nevertheless I would imagine I bring more than an extra £1500 worth of value to the company than a graduate.

 

[TPL]

Yep - you're being shafted

 

[Ussuri]

You are now part of the pay review structure. Typically the rate at which they pay grads has increased quicker than the pay of the senior staff. The salary band between graduate and director gets squeezed ever thinner. Especially now with all the pay freezes in place. I have to say, if you stay, it wont get any better. You need to move to maximise the pay rise/effect of getting chartered.

 

[oneintheeye]

yeah well I probably got my chartership at the worst time, right in a recession. Think I'll have to have a tentative look around. I really wouldn't want to leave as I really like working here and its convenient to home etc. But nothing a few grand won't make up for

 

[Ussuri]

Judging by the distinct lack of job adverts in the back of the NCE I dont know if there is much out there at the moment. UK civils has never been renowned for the voluminous salaries though.

You could try speaking with your line manager directly and making your case. I have done that in the past and it has worked. Do you know how your renumeration stacks up against similarly qualified colleagues?

 

[oneintheeye]

there is not much comparison really. one other probably does a similar role but he more experienced than me and has more varied experience. He is paid substantially more than me though (i only know ball park figures but around 15000 pound more I believe). Others are either doing a slightly different role (one paid substantially more) or are more junior. Or are my bosses. It appears even the most junior are only just less than me.

 

[Ussuri]

Sounds like you are underpaid.

 

[oneintheeye]

sounds like it yes. Its amazing how I could quit go back to college and re apply as a graduate and be not significantly worse off. I wouldn't know how to approach my boss in a way that won't backfire. Maybe I should look around and then go back to him.

 

[Ussuri]

Keeping salaries secret only benefits an employer. It means they can pay everyone the minimum they are willing to work for, without worrying about people getting upset that colleagues get more.

I raised my salary concerns with my line manager at my annual performance review. I told him I felt my pay was less than my colleagues and asked him to investigate on my behalf. He did, and returned telling me their was an anomaly, which they fixed by increasing my pay accordingly.

 

[KENAT]

Look around, also maybe hint at if there is some other responsibility or task or something that you'd need to take on to warrant the raise in their mind. While you may well be underpaid, you've accepted it for however long and unless they already realize they're underpaying you they may not jump to give you more money to do the same thing. The extra responsibility need not be that large, just something nominal to justify the raise to accounting/management types.

Posting guidelines faq731-376

http://eng-tips.com/market.cfm?

(probably not aimed specifically at you)
What is Engineering anyway: faq1088-1484​

 

[oneintheeye]

by convenience we have been told reviews are not for discussing pay issues. We are also told that the review has no impact on pay rises but I have evidence that suggests it does. We have also been told that there will be no annual pay rises this year for anyone(TBC). Of course a couple of favourites have been promoted to get around that issue.