API 1104 - 6.4 Visual Examination 3

[Joss10]

Dear mates,

For a qualification test weld to meet the requirements for visual examination, the weld shall be free from cracks,
inadequate penetration, and BT and must present a neat workman-like appearance.

"Neat workman-like appearance", How is it evaluated?

The weld was free of cracks, undercuts, spatter, right weld reinforcement but was ugly, sloppy, irregular, it should be rejected anyway?

What are the fundamentals?

Thanks in advance for any contribution on this controversial issue.

 

[mk3223]

"Neat workman-like appearance", How is it evaluated?

It can be subjective by Inspectors of either the Owner's, the Contractor's, or 3rd Party.
First, IMO, it's difficult to pass a weld test if the weld is ugly, sloppy, or irregular shape. And, no Inspector will accept it no matter which side he/she belongs to.

 

[DekDee]

joss10,
Judging whether a weld is acceptable based on the limited visual acceptance criteria of both ASME IX and API 1104 is never easy.
On one hand, you cannot reject an " ugly" weld if it complies with all the requirements of the applicable code.
But, do you want to sign off on a welder qualification certificate of a welder who obviously needs more training ?
That is where experience comes in.
If you are experienced you make a decision based on experience.
If you are inexperienced you get on an internet forum and ask for help.

 

[Joss10]

Two responses with different acceptance criteria against an ugly weld.
It is not the point of experienced or inexperienced, who searches or researches online is because different visions on the same topic can contribute experiences or opinions of different audiences, which can enrich their own.
In this case, an experienced "Petroleum" thinks differently than another "Mechanical", it does not seem to me to base an acceptance / rejection criterion only on experience, so I am looking for something new in specialized forums.
So far I had no luck but I keep trying.

 

[DekDee]

You will find nothing no matter how hard you search.
The person who decides whether it is a " neat, workman like appearance" is the person who witnesses the test and ultimately signs the welder qualification certificate.
It is based solely on their personal opinion of " neat, workman like appearance"
That is the point I was trying to make about experience - there are numerous mitigating circumstances in a weld test that can lead to an ugly weld.
Poor welding equipment, poor electrodes,extreme weather etc, etc.
You have to explore those yourself and if there are none you fail the test.
Experience will tell you if a welder has produced an ugly weld because it is his/hers first time and they are overcome with nerves.
Experience will tell you if a welder who has produced an ugly weld has absolutely zero welding ability.
By passing or failing a welder you may be responsible for that persons short term future so you have to decide (again I come back to experience) - am I confident this welder can improve ?
If you think so, explain why you think their welds are ugly and give them another test.

I do not agree with most of mk3223s post but I do agree with his comment regarding subjective.
If you are the one putting your name/stamp on a welder qualification certificate then you are the only one who can decide if it is of a " neat, workman like appearance" - nobody else.

 

[Joss10]

In essence, if I have to ask, it is because I want to learn from the experience of others while enriching mine.
People asking and people answering is the essence and motive of life of this and all forums.

 

[weldstan]

I've always visually evaluated welder qualification welds at interludes during the making thereof; e.g., during fit up, the root pass, hot pass and fill pass stacking in addition to the completed weld and I have discontinued the test during all of the above when I concluded that the welder was unable to produce acceptable welds in production. I have developed instruction manuals and training programs for our inspectors to describe with photos and actual physical weld samples of acceptable and unacceptable completed welds. It is not the intent of my company's welder qualification program to provide a body incapable of making sound welds in production. The intent is to hire a welder who will consistently make acceptable welds.

 

[alchemon]

The point of the visual examination is to verify.... does the finished product look the one on the procedures page.

Is alignment maintained? You will be able to tell if the alignment is off. Did they weld on the correct type fitting - most have the specifications stamped on them. Correct weld rods used? Adequate number of passes? Is the weld cap “all the way done”? Sometimes they try to skim on the top cap on thicker wall welds. You can also sometimes see inside to see the root. This is the most important - normally, if you can visually see it.