Best Motors and VSD's 1

[afterhrs]

I have noticed that the one thing that people in this forum like to discuss is QUALITY. There have been a few threads recently that address contactors. I am starting this thread so people may voice an opinion on the their motor and drive of choice.
I am by no means an expert on the subject, but I have found that ABB ACS-600 drives are very reliable and
for most applications I run into , easy to program.
I would also encourage all to include experiences with DC drives.

Best regards,
Afterhrs

 

[jbartos]

Suggestion: One good thing about ABB off the shelf drives is that they have available MTBF, etc. from ABB

 

[jOmega]

JB:

From first hand experience, I can tell you that their MTBF number are pure fiction !

BTW : The ACS 600 has been COST REDUCED and is now the ACS 800. So much for quality and reliability.

jOmega

 

[gcaudill]

I installed hundreds of ABB drives (ACS600) in a new plant and have had less than 5 failures in 4 years. I think they are terrific and very adaptable with little effort. The fact that the factory will work with you on firmware for special applications is even better.

I do not know about the ACS800.

 

[jOmega]

gcaudill:

Please do not mistake my comments as a knock on the ACS 600.

I'm a big fan of it... and lived thru its birth and consequent rehabilitation.

My comments were a rebuttal of JB's reference to their MTBF numbers. There are a couple of other threads on the subject of MTBF numbers with regard to VFDs ... and their lack of veracity and meaningfulness.

Time will tell whether the ACS 800 enjoys the same reliability that the ACS 600 did.

I guess one would have to be extremely naive to believe that cost reductions don't affect quality and reliability.

One of the ways they've reduced the physical size, was to reduce the area of the heatsink which now requires that a lot more air be moved thru the unit to achieve requisite cooling.

What do you think the life of the fans are....?

Larger size drives, with more heatsink area, can afford to operate with the fans off until heatsink temperature requires additional cooling.... Saves life of fans.

ACS 800 fans run all the time.... ergo ... shorter life.

Time... will tell.

Oh, and most drive mfgrs, will offer custom software for their systems drives for the right price... The ACS 600 is a systems drive. The ACS 400 was their off-the-shelf drive (recently replaced by the ACS 550).

 

[GGOSS]

Hello all,

I would agree with comments made by JOmega relating to MTBF values. As this has been well addressed in other threads, I don't see a need to continue those discussions here.

On the subject of fan life however, I would suggest fans (together with many other pieces of electrical equipment) have a much longer service life if they are left powered/running, not switched. In simplistic terms, the bearings and windings of a fan left running are exposed to less 'stress' than of one which is switched. Confirmation of this can be obtained from any fan manufacturer.

As this is a technical forum, I will refrain from pushing any products or brands.

Regards,
GGOSS

 

[PUMPDESIGNER]

We do not have a large enough installed base to make definitive statements. However for what it is worth, here are the two drives we have installed.

General Electric AF300-P11 - Have four units up for about 3 years, no problems at all, not one. One unit was installed on an admittedly bad electrical supply where another brand failed horribly. Unit has worked flawlessly.

Goulds makes a variable speed drive for their pumps called Aquavar. Terrible, awful, stay away, cannot emphasize enough how bad they are. Out of four units installed, only one still working in 3 years. Some units replaced multiple times. Some units bad within one week. As stated above, replaced one Goulds unit with GE unit, never any more problems.

PUMPDESIGNER

 

[jsummerfield]

The thread title Best motors and VFDs is very open ended. I anticipated this to address standard specifications such as IEEE Std 841-2001; IEEE Standard for Petroleum and Chemical Industry—Severe Duty Totally Enclosed Fan-Cooled (TEFC) Squirrel Cage Induction Motors— Up to and Including 370 kW (500 hp). This seems to be a good specification for motors in areas classified Class I Division 2 and not suitable for Division 1.

My limited drive experience is with Toshiba for small drives to about 100 hp. All experience is good. We have purchased Ross Hill for large drives over 11000 hp. I did not go to the job site and have no idea how well they work but they are big.


John

 

[AFab]

My past preferances were either Reliance or AC Tech (smaller 20hp and under). Since Rockwell aquired Reliance the AB line sparks a striking resemblance to the Reliance.
The ABB ACS600 are now install as the drive of choise in are plant and I have no complants thus far. Technical service from our supplier is also good. This is a major concideration when deciding on a brand name or supplier.

 

[peebee]

I used to work for a pharmaceutical plant where they had many many VFD's.

The old ones (15 yrs. & older) were all Robocon's. I don't think they're even around anymore. They built HUGE refrigerator-sized VFD's that cost a fortune.

Everthing since then has been ABB.

Both choices were based purely on reliability.

 

[tmahan]

Every year more and more companies produce variable speed drives.

In response to this pressure the major producers (guys like ABB, Toshiba, AB, Siemens) have had to struggle to keep their product from being "just another drive" . The way most have chosen to go is by being "better" both in terms of reliablity and features.

I'm not saying that a VFD from a developing nation is not reliable. I am saying that the more major players are very protective of their reputations. To protect that reputation they spend that little extra for better diodes caps resistors... ect and usually charge a bit more for the product, its up to the consumer to decide if that extra cost is worth it or not.

 

[GGOSS]

Hello peebee,

I suspect you might be referring to 'Robicon' (note the spelling). If so they are certainly still around.

Go to

http://www.robicon.com

Regards,
GGOSS

 

[afterhrs]

I regret starting this thread after hearing about the ABB ACS600 series and the fact our company bought two AQUAVAIR drives last year. Although the AQUAVAIR drives haven't given us any problems thus far.

Afterhrs

 

[peebee]

GGOSS -- Oh yeah. Thanks.

 

[drivetech]

I have worked with many drives and motors, and I have to say that Eurotherm Drives and Reliance Motors are the best.
I have to admit that there are many drives out there that run without a problem for many years, but what makes a dive good or bad is how easy the drive is to fix when it does go down. Many drives give you a fault code that either has to be rembered or looked up, all of which takes time. If the drive can tell you what the problem in the language that a person speaks all the better.

 

[jbartos]

Suggestion: If there are no objective criteria, such as reliability criteria, then the drive and motor grading may become too subjective and reduced to mere experiences. Especially, if there are no other drives being used for comparisons.