bottom line Space-(explorer, pilot pro, navigator) question

[connorsfc]

Recently my purchase of NX 7.5 was approved, and while out of the CAD community in general for a couple years, it's nice to be back.

So, after getting by with only a mouse for the last handful of months, I've decided to go with a Space-something to help with speed of operation.

I've read a handful of posts here, and from what I've read it seems like the Spacepilot pro's buttons more or less suck, and most people get by with a SpaceNavigator, or SpaceNavigator for laptops.

Since it will take a while for me to get back up to pro-speed and skill, and if the basic Navigator is what it seems most of you actually use....has anything changed as of late where it would advantageous to go with something other than a Navigator?

 

[wecurb]

Check out Space Maus. It looks slick. Pricey but slick.

http://www.spacecontrolmaus.com/spacemaus-cap-ball.html

 

[moog2]

just look for a FX 5000 (USB) on e-bay, they're not the most up to date, but they're comfortable, have programmable buttons, and they're cheap as....

 

[RML1]

I use the explorer, which is the familiar shape evolution of historic space balls and a great product. I have a Navigator at home, which is also excellent and does all you need. The only advantage I find with the explorer is that your hand resting on the device itself is more comfortable for using all day every day than with the navigator. Also, although the navigator is heavy enough to resist moving, it does occasionally move on the desk if you are moving a part upwards.

We trialled a pilot, but as I don't really find any of the buttons that useful (on any of them) its really just more expensive for no real reason (other than for 'bling' factor).

Question - In NX7.5 the space ball no longer automatically locks rotations whilst in the sketch task environment and changes back again when you exit (as it did in previous versions). I have reinstalled the latest drivers with the NXv3-7.5 add in, but no help. You can still press the 2D button when in a sketch and press it again when you exit, but it’s just a pain when you are doing it maybe up to 100 times a day! Anyone else got this problem and managed to solve it? I assume it’s a 3D connexion issue rather than NX?

 

[JohnRBaker]

I don't recall that the Spaceball has ever had any special behavior when entering or leaving the Sketch task (but I wish it did). The only time that it appears to change behavior is when you open a Drawing, but then it's not the Spaceball that's doing anything as NX itself has automatically disabled any 3D movements when working in the context of a Drawing.

BTW, I use a Space Pilot Pro in the office, a Space Navigator at home and when on the road, a Space Navigator for Laptops.

John R. Baker, P.E.
Product 'Evangelist'
Product Design Solutions
Siemens PLM Software Inc.
Industry Sector
Cypress, CA

http://www.siemens.com/plm

http://www.plmworld.org/museum/

To an Engineer, the glass is twice as big as it needs to be.

 

[phillpd]

I agree with RML1, that behaviour (entering the Sketch) did exist.

NX 6.0.5.3 (NX 8 Beta)
Windows XP32

 

[connorsfc]

Thanks everyone, I think I might try and go with an Explorer for the office and a Navigator for travel (which together would cost about the same as a Pilot Pro)

 

[JohnRBaker]

For travel, I would recommend spending the extra $100 or so and go for the Navigator for Laptops. It's virtually identical to the regular Navigator, but it's smaller, lighter and comes with a really neat leather travel case. Also, the bottom is covered with this amazing 'rubber-like' plastic which must have a coefficient of friction approaching 0.90. Wherever you put this thing, it stays there. Much better than even the regular Navigator, despite it being significantly lighter.

John R. Baker, P.E.
Product 'Evangelist'
Product Design Solutions
Siemens PLM Software Inc.
Industry Sector
Cypress, CA

http://www.siemens.com/plm

http://www.plmworld.org/museum/

To an Engineer, the glass is twice as big as it needs to be.

 

[connorsfc]

roger that John, putting in a PO today actually

 

[moog2]

another time that the spaceball no longer locks to the X-Y plane is when you are creating a broken view, NX5 it stayed locked, NX6 it doesn't, it makes it a bit hard

 

[almakuch]

As John B, I too use both the Navigator and Pilot at home and office. In travel I us the Pilot. On the Pilot I set the to HOT keys to lock rotation out, to work in die view orientation, and the other set to fit screen. I have grown acustom to the Pilot.

 

[Dave K]

The 3D to 3D behavior, when going into/out of a sketch, was a driver version. I remember when 3Dconnexion was messing with that. I was in contact with them, asking for a toggle, or some option, that would enable/disable that behavior. Some users liked it, others didn't.

-Dave

NX 5.0.6.3mp7

 

[RML1]

3D connexion reply to my query about the loss of rotations being locked automatically in sketches:

"What might feel to you now as a bug, is actually an implemented feature. From what I have learned this is a change in the NX add-in. It was changed upon customer request.
Using the 2D button is unfortunately your only option for now, however I will forward your opinion to the product manager."

Does anyone else find this a real pain? I have requested that they at least make this a user switchable option and asked if there is a suitable old driver I can go back to (although I suspect not one that will work with NX7.5). I suppose it ties in with the new 'direct sketch' method, but I only find that useful for editing a sketch, I still want to draw a sketch in 2D - mainly because it is 2D! I can't understand why people want 3D in a sketch, you can always middle mouse button rotate for the rare occasions its necessary.

 

[RML1]

In reply to moog2 regarding the rotations in broken view. Rotations are now possible in all expanded drawing views, which is not helpful (you get a half 3D wireframe). In NX7.5 both space mouse and normal mouse can rotate in expanded. Just checked NX5 (its useful still having a copy for reference like this) you could also rotate with the mouse, but not the space mouse. I have both versions open on the same machine at the same time, so the only difference is NX, so assume this one is nothing to do with 3D Connexion?

 

[JohnRBaker]

One thing to keep in mind, when entering the Sketch Task environment, there is NO guarantee that you will automatically be placed in a 2D view normal to the screen. That is purely an optional behavior controlled by Sketch Preferences.

And now with the advent of 'Direct Sketching', that is the ability to create and edit a Sketch WITHOUT entering the Sketch Task environment at all, the desire to limit the Spaceball would be completely counter-intuitive to say nothing of counter-productive. So even if we were to consider whether to somehow try to automatically control when the Spaceball would or would not allow 3D rotations, this would now require additional logic, and perhaps even preference settings to describe exactly under WHAT conditions would the user want the 2D behavior enforced and when not to.

And while we're at it, since NX also supports 2D and 3D rotational control using Mouse gestures, how do you want that to behave when you enter the Sketch Task environment?

The reason that we can handle the enforced 2D behavior when working in the context of a Drawing is because NX itself is working in 2D ONLY when in a Drawing, whether a Spaceball is being used or not.

John R. Baker, P.E.
Product 'Evangelist'
Product Design Solutions
Siemens PLM Software Inc.
Industry Sector
Cypress, CA

http://www.siemens.com/plm

http://www.plmworld.org/museum/

To an Engineer, the glass is twice as big as it needs to be.

 

[RML1]

For me the distinction is that for the 'direct sketch' mode (or what I would call the edit mode) the current 3D behaviour is correct. In the 'sketch task environment' (or in my mind the creation mode) it is 2D only. The space mouse behaviour could be toggled alongside the sketch preferance to change the view orientation. Or alongside the customer default that decides if the sketch edit mode is 'direct' or 'task environment'. I can't understand why anyone wants to create a sketch whilst not normal to the plane (so for example a sqare needs to be drawn as a parallelgram), but the toggle would keep all happy.

The enforced 2D behavior in the drawing is an interesting one as the expanded view does not respect this and can move in 3D. It used to stay locked in 2D on NX5 for the space mouse, but in 7.5 it is not.

 

[JohnRBaker]

I think you will find over time that having to use the 'Expand View' function in Drafting is going to become less of an issue and may soon become an all-but-obsolete function.

BTW, I feel the same way you do about creating Sketches in the task environment versus as a 'direct' sketch, but we are having to accommodate more and more users who are coming from other CAD systems where sketching has always been done in whatever environment that they are in (i.e., NO special Sketch task environment, 2D or otherwise).

John R. Baker, P.E.
Product 'Evangelist'
Product Design Solutions
Siemens PLM Software Inc.
Industry Sector
Cypress, CA

http://www.siemens.com/plm

http://www.plmworld.org/museum/

To an Engineer, the glass is twice as big as it needs to be.