Can MSE/keystones wall be plasterd/stucco'd or cemented over the surface?

[ANgK]

We hope to have a smooth wall that matched the rest of the house but poured in place concrete is not possible due to limited footing.

MSE is one of the solution but we don't like the honeycomb look of the MSE wall. Is it possible to put stucco or painted cement over the face of the wall?

Any other ideas?

 

[EireChch]

I think you should give Tensar or Maceferri a call. They are are the suppliers who ultimately make the call and take the liability in terms of guarantee.

 

[BridgeSmith]

One of the reasons block-faced MSE walls are so useful is that they're very flexible. That's going to present a huge problem for your situation. You'd end up with cracks likely at every joint. The good news is there are numerous options for facing of MSE walls, including precast concrete panels, which can be done with almost any texture or pattern, or none at all. The companies EireChch mentioned would be good places to start. I think they only manufacture the soil reinforcements, but they work with most of the companies that produce facing panels. They should be able to point you in the right direction.

 

[ANgK]

What they did here is similar to what I have in mind. Simple rectangular precast panels with narrow panel simulating a pilaster. What do you guy think?

https://www.reinforcedearth.com/pro...hetic-feature-la-villita-apartment-homes.html

 

[BridgeSmith]

Yep, precast concrete facing panels for MSE walls are available in a wide variety of patterns, almost anything a guy could want. Whatever complements the look of nearby structures.

The one piece of advice from what I learned in architectural design classes: Don't try to match something existing exactly; you'll never accomplish it, and it will look like you tried...and failed. Always make something new look enough different that it's clear you weren't trying match something else.

 

[bridgebuster]

@ANgK - what sort of foundation is your house going to rest on? Residential footings are usually 2'-0" to 2'-6" wide.

 

[ANgK]

This is for an elevated driveway next to the house.

I found MESA from Tensar can provide the wall face that complement the style of the house.

However, I still want a white solid railing on top of this MSE wall to complement the Spanish style of the house but I don't know how to integrate it into the MSE wall and what type of material I should use.

This is how I hope the solid wall railing would look:

 

[BridgeSmith]

The trick is to match the style...while complementing the look...without attempting to match colors. That's why architects get the big bucks (eventually).

 

[ANgK]

Can that type of solid wall go on top of a MSE wall?

 

[BridgeSmith]

On top of an MSE wall? I'm not sure what you're asking. On top of the facing or the reinforced backfill?

 

[ANgK]

The MSE wall is reinforcing the backfill dirt. We need a 3 ft stand alone wall (acting as a solid railing), either on the top of the MSE block or on the top of the backfill dirt.

 

[BridgeSmith]

Either I'm misunderstanding your terminology, or you're talking about a completely different approach than what I was envisioning from the earlier discussion. I thought we were discussing a mechanically stabilized earth wall, where the reinforced "backfill dirt" is the wall. The type of facing that is attached to the reinforcement (geogrids or metal strip reinforcements) was the issue for discussion, right?

If that is the case, an integrated system where the facing of the MSE wall is extended up the 3 feet above grade should be easy to accommodate, as long as the reinforced soil height isn't tiny (less than 3' of reinforced height could make the stresses on the top layer of reinforcement very high if any load is applied to the top of the facing 3' above grade).

 

[bridgebuster]

You shouldn’t need geogrid for a 3’ wall. There are numerous gravity walls systems out there and they have details for mounting railings. Google Recon, Allen Block, Keystone Block, Strong Stone, Redi-Rock, or precast block walls.

 

[BridgeSmith]

I guess it's way past time to ask, how tall is the retaining wall (grade elevation in front of the wall to grade elevation behind the wall)?

Also, if the wall above grade is acting as a railing, is 36" tall enough to meet the applicable code requirements?

 

[BridgeSmith]

bridgebuster, while Redi-rock and Stone Strong may be large enough blocks to support the required lateral load on a railing, the Keystone and other small-block systems would likely need more substantial anchorage than the typical gravity wall construction provides.

 

[ANgK]

Thank you for all the answers. The code calls for 36'' railing. I think we will just get the blocks/wall face to go beyond the soil one to act as railing.

 

[bridgebuster]

HotRod10 - I wasn't recommending a specific system. I've been involved in about a dozen or so projects with proprietary wall systems; you have to do your homework to find the right one. In theory, a gravity wall is a gravity wall but the manufacturers have their nuances. Regarding anchorage of a railing, unless the the OP has to design for a TL loading the rail can be mounted to the block or set in concrete in front of the wall. If he has to account for some robust railing load then the railing has to be about 3 feet behind the wall.

 

[BridgeSmith]

bridgebuster, I think we're on the same page for the most part. I was just throwing out a caution that without a separate anchorage of some kind, a facing made up of small blocks like Keystone would likely not support even the loading required for a pedestrian railing.

If a concrete slab behind the wall is an option, it could provide a heel to support the railing without needing to anchor it into the soil behind the wall.