Car carrier on fire 1

[CWB1]

Eh, crap happens. The media obviously needs a bit of filler this week.

 

[SwinnyGG]

Thanks Hokie... didn't know the percentage... I wonder why?

Onboard wages, safety rules, minimum conditions, etc are a function of the labor laws in the country in which the ship is registered.

So yeah running a ship that flagged in the US or a first world european country is astronomically more expensive than the commons flags of convenience (panama, liberia, etc)

 

[hokie66]

It looks like the ship won't be scuttled.

https://edition.cnn.com/2022/02/22/tech/cargo-ship-fire-update/index.html

 

[FacEngrPE]

Ship carrying thousands of luxury cars to U.S. sinks in Atlantic Ocean CBS News - 3h ago

Joao Mendes Cabecas, the captain of the nearest port on the island of Faial, told Reuters the ship sank as efforts to tow it began due to structural problems caused by the fire and rough seas.

"When the towing started ... water started to come in," he told Reuters. "The ship lost its stability and sank."

The Portuguese navy confirmed the sinking, saying it occurred outside Portuguese waters at a depth of about 30,000 feet.

 

[dik]

Any idea of the value... maybe $300M? Read the article $155M...
Rather than think climate change and the corona virus as science, think of it as the wrath of God. Feel any better?

-Dik

 

[FacEngrPE]

both numbers seem to be correct. 155m in bentleys-and-lamborghinis.

https://www.autonews.com/retail/burnt-out-ship-carrying-4000-vws-porsches-audis-bentleys-and-lamborghinis-sinks-rough-seas[/URL]]In a projection assuming all vehicles would be lost, the risk-modeling company Russell Group last week estimated that the incident could cost the automaker at least $155 million. About $438 million worth of goods were aboard the ship, $401 million of which were cars.

 

[LittleInch]

I suspect they meant 3,000m, not 30,000 ft... Deepest bit of the Atlantic is 27,000ft.

Remember - More details = better answers
Also: If you get a response it's polite to respond to it.

 

[1503-44]

I can't imagine they didn't have insurance.
Looks like 3-4000m.

https://www.gebco.net/data_and_prod...et/data_and_products/gridded_bathymetry_data/

A black swan to a turkey is a white swan to the butcher ... and to Boeing.

 

[dik]

Do they have 'quick disconnects' on tow lines?

Rather than think climate change and the corona virus as science, think of it as the wrath of God. Feel any better?

-Dik

 

[1503-44]

Yes. A very necessary safety feature.
I forget what they call the guy with the hatchet.

I remembered. Rudy Giuliani.
A black swan to a turkey is a white swan to the butcher ... and to Boeing.

 

[Cool_Controls]

Link

 

[Alistair_Heaton]

to note these are mandatory in most places in the world but not in the USA. I have already had a discussion with TUG on the subject and it turned out the regulations are completely different.

You get a bollard tow which is a rope from the towed vessel to the tug which then gets put on a f'kin great big post on the boat and the only way you can get rid of it is via axe.

Then you have the quick release hooks as pictured which have been used for 70 odd years in Europe for normal vessel shunting.

If the towed vessel can't put out a rope then the big tugs can put out reel cable but it has to go through a BOP type setup with a pair of shear jaws plus back up and a hydraulic accumulators which can cut the tow rope in under a second. But apparently when they do its lethal and will more than likely cut through the bow of the vessel being towed.

USA they use a brake system with a live end so the whole lot runs out and then releases when the cable runs out. But that usually results in a fire onboard from the reel drum and brake unit.

I have zero clue about the pluses and minuses of both systems but its seems to be in the same league as 240V V 110V for domestic electricity as a pissing match between the two methods.

 

[dik]

Thanks, Cool...

Rather than think climate change and the corona virus as science, think of it as the wrath of God. Feel any better?

-Dik

 

[zeusfaber]

Main reason for wanting to lose a tow quickly is less about being pulled down if the tow sinks and more to stop you being pulled over if it overtakes and starts to pull you sideways. "Girting" is deadly.

A.

 

[TugboatEng]

Modern tow winches have fail in free spool option (except for Jon Rie but they're despised in the industry by everybody but shareholders). Push a button, all brakes and clutches release. The wire pays out and is weakly fastened to the drum.

Inland boats still use bitts for towing but anything offshore is on winches.

Here is an example of an emergency release being bypassed while experiencing a sinking tow resulting in a fatality of a crew member.

https://www.tsb.gc.ca/eng/rapports-reports/marine/2013/m13n0014/m13n0014.html

The secondary brake is unusual. The winch likely had a capstain and motor brakes are intended for holding the capstain only.

 

[itsmoked]

As in tight enough to never fall off?

Why on that disaster barge cruise did they extend the tow line 1 meter per day? Wear?

Keith Cress
kcress -

http://www.flaminsystems.com

 

[TugboatEng]

Why on that disaster barge cruise did they extend the tow line 1 meter per day? Wear?

Yes, the tugs have rollers on the steen to prevent wear as the wire is paid in and out but the side to side motion during tow puts flat spots in the rollers. Sadly, our industry has not figured out that hardened rollers are the solution. Some companies will install a tow shoe which is a plastic faced plate that clamps to the wire. Then you pay the wire out until the shoe sits on the roller.

Tight enough to never fall off? Friction transfers the towing forces to the drum. When the drum is empty with no more layers all fo the force is transferred to the hold down which is weak and will break. We usually maintain 2-3 layers minimum on a drum.

With that said, as a company we only do occasional offshore tows. Most of my experience is with high performance synthetic rope on drums for ship docking. High performance synthetic rope is much more slippery and much less elastic than steel so there are some additional considerations.

 

[Alistair_Heaton]

Its was a Schmitt Boka that was towing it I think.

Schmitt are definitely EU rags so will need hydraulic shears to cut the cable.

 

[LittleInch]

but if the rollers were hardened wouldn't movement of the wire rope start fraying the rope?

Remember - More details = better answers
Also: If you get a response it's polite to respond to it.

 

[TugboatEng]

That tug will have 3.5"ish towing wire. Shears would be quite large and I do not see such a device in the photo.

That orange hook shaped thing in the center, we employ a bunch of the descendents of its inventor.

LI, with soft steel, the cable just cuts grooves in the rollers and guides making the surface longer smooth which snags the cable. A drum will usually have 2000 feet of wire while a roller may only have 6 feet of circumference so the wear gets distributed along the wire but is quite concentrated on the roller.