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Coating for Carbon Steel? 5
- Thread starter jmcgrath
- Start date
- Thread starter
- #3
- Thread starter
- #5
Rubber coating will not work as it is going to be exposed to temperatures of up to 400F. I expect the solution (if there is one) will either be ceramic/enamel or some sort of plastic.
I just need some help in finding the right one.
Thanks anyway,
John
I just need some help in finding the right one.
Thanks anyway,
John
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John
Don't be too quick to discount Rubber.
Some silicones are good to 315 deg C (599 F) and 245,000 ohm-cm.
About a month ago there was a thread on ceramic sources.
Coors Porelain in Golden, Co and at least one other. Ceramic might not be flexible enough for 15" rad. It depends on the cross section of the steel (actually Moment of Inertia) and the Modulus of Elasticity of the ceramic. If it is a very small cross-section, it could work. You might need to thermally spray the coating which I believe is termed plasma spraying. Or you could coat with Aluminum Oxide Al2O3 using the Mo-Mn process which is a fairly involved technique but achieves very strong bond between the steel and ceramic. However, at 400F the differential in thermal exansion between Carbon Steel and Al2O3 might be enough to crack the coating. Are you stuck with Carbon Steel? There are other metal alloys that have thermal expansion coefficient that match closely with ceramics. One is named Kovar that matches with Al2O3.
Leonard Jesus is the WAY
Don't be too quick to discount Rubber.
Some silicones are good to 315 deg C (599 F) and 245,000 ohm-cm.
About a month ago there was a thread on ceramic sources.
Coors Porelain in Golden, Co and at least one other. Ceramic might not be flexible enough for 15" rad. It depends on the cross section of the steel (actually Moment of Inertia) and the Modulus of Elasticity of the ceramic. If it is a very small cross-section, it could work. You might need to thermally spray the coating which I believe is termed plasma spraying. Or you could coat with Aluminum Oxide Al2O3 using the Mo-Mn process which is a fairly involved technique but achieves very strong bond between the steel and ceramic. However, at 400F the differential in thermal exansion between Carbon Steel and Al2O3 might be enough to crack the coating. Are you stuck with Carbon Steel? There are other metal alloys that have thermal expansion coefficient that match closely with ceramics. One is named Kovar that matches with Al2O3.
Leonard Jesus is the WAY
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1. There are many different ceramics.
2. Many can be made readily brazeable
3. They can pretty well be cast in any shape you wish
4. Is this a fixed bend or is it going to be flexing?
5. You can compensate for the differences in rates of thermal expansion with proper joint design and braze alloy. We did a lot of work on this with Weyerhaeuser years ago. See - brazing book
6.
How’s TiCN?
Electrical Properties Property Value Units
Electrical Resistivity 17-22 x10^-6 Ohm's x cm
Magnetic Suceptibility +10 x10^-6 emu/mol
Superconductive Temperature 10 K
Tom
2. Many can be made readily brazeable
3. They can pretty well be cast in any shape you wish
4. Is this a fixed bend or is it going to be flexing?
5. You can compensate for the differences in rates of thermal expansion with proper joint design and braze alloy. We did a lot of work on this with Weyerhaeuser years ago. See - brazing book
6.
How’s TiCN?
Electrical Properties Property Value Units
Electrical Resistivity 17-22 x10^-6 Ohm's x cm
Magnetic Suceptibility +10 x10^-6 emu/mol
Superconductive Temperature 10 K
Tom
- Thread starter
- #8
Guys,
The metal that is going to be coated is a 0.108” strand of carbon steel wire that will be lowered in on oil well for 18,000 ft and then pulled back out again several times. The bottom hole temperature can get up to 400F as well as having various chemical such as H2S and CO2 down there. I’m pretty sure that rubber will not be able to take the combination of wear, temp and chemical attack and still give an acceptable life span.
For the wear at temperature and chemical inertness my money is on a ceramic. Can you recommend any sources where I can get better aquainted with current ceramic technology and capabilities?
Thanks for your help,
John
The metal that is going to be coated is a 0.108” strand of carbon steel wire that will be lowered in on oil well for 18,000 ft and then pulled back out again several times. The bottom hole temperature can get up to 400F as well as having various chemical such as H2S and CO2 down there. I’m pretty sure that rubber will not be able to take the combination of wear, temp and chemical attack and still give an acceptable life span.
For the wear at temperature and chemical inertness my money is on a ceramic. Can you recommend any sources where I can get better aquainted with current ceramic technology and capabilities?
Thanks for your help,
John
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You might investigate the ferritic nitrocarburizing process as a potential coating. The coating itself is insulating (you didn't mention why this is important). Kolene is the leader in this industry:
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How about boronizing? It is hard and corrosion resistant. But it is brittle as other ceramic coatings.
Generally thin layers of TiN or TiCN (less than 3 or 5 microns) should be okay. These coatings are PVD or CVD coatings and will cost $$$.
The wear seems to be between the wireline and the pipe. The general hardness of the pipe is around 25HRC and if your wire line is tribologically compatiple with (slightly harder than?) the pipe, it should not wear much. Where does the abrasion mechanism comes from? maybe from the ingrained sand or drilling medium? Make sure the type of wear (adhesive, abrasive or corrosive) you are attacking before selecting a material and/or coating.
Generally thin layers of TiN or TiCN (less than 3 or 5 microns) should be okay. These coatings are PVD or CVD coatings and will cost $$$.
The wear seems to be between the wireline and the pipe. The general hardness of the pipe is around 25HRC and if your wire line is tribologically compatiple with (slightly harder than?) the pipe, it should not wear much. Where does the abrasion mechanism comes from? maybe from the ingrained sand or drilling medium? Make sure the type of wear (adhesive, abrasive or corrosive) you are attacking before selecting a material and/or coating.
rustbuster1
Materials
Using carbon steel seems a bit illogical. Why not use a stainless steel wire? In theory it creates its own CrOxide passive film and could be "passivated" to enhance the film. Applying a ceramic coating to carbon steel wire this size is fairly impractical because of such a small radius. Cr plating or EN plating could put a durable "skin" with controlled quality on the wire. but I still wouldn't expect these options to be cost-effective over stainless steel.
rustbuster1
Materials
I apologize, I forgot you want it to be electrically insulated so it would have to have a sheath or coating to accomplish that....
DrSivakumar
Materials
We have developed a nano-composite siloxane based coating, which is tough, adherent and is highly resistant to sand and rain erosion and cavitation.
I would be happy to discuss with you the details. Please contact me at <kumar@asm-usa.com> or visit our web site <
Thanks,
Sivakumar
I would be happy to discuss with you the details. Please contact me at <kumar@asm-usa.com> or visit our web site <
Thanks,
Sivakumar
- Thread starter
- #16
There is a wealth of ceramics information at Just ask it what you want and it will provide you with an answer!
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- #20
Pardal,
The shielded wire that you mention is available from several different suppliers and this is what has been used for 30/40 years in the oil field applications that I am looking at. There are several inherent problems with this design and the solution that I am looking for (i.e. a smooth coated wire) will solve them all.
I just hope that the technology is out there to do it.
John
The shielded wire that you mention is available from several different suppliers and this is what has been used for 30/40 years in the oil field applications that I am looking at. There are several inherent problems with this design and the solution that I am looking for (i.e. a smooth coated wire) will solve them all.
I just hope that the technology is out there to do it.
John
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