Colors on the "blue" prints 3

[CheckerHater]

I have an unusual question (as most of the people on the forum).

As someone who grew up in the times of pencils, paper and poor quality blueprints I am a firm believer into strictly black-and-white linework.

Nevertheless in today’s world you can hardly find B&W printer or copier if you want to buy one.

So my question is: Does anyone see the advantage in using color in engineering (besides obvious applications for Maps and Architecture), and did anyone ever encounter standard regulating use of color. (Once again, not just color to indicate AutoCAD layers, but “final product” print actually made in color.)

I will welcome both: references to actual standards and opinions based on experience.

 

[MintJulep]

Eventually it will be faxed, or scanned in B&W and emailed, or copied on a B&W copier.

Then your color information will be lost for the receiver.

 

[TheTick]

When I make a drawing, I make sure it is readable in black-and-white. However, I will use shaded views on isometric and exploded views if it helps make things more clear to the reader (again, must be readable in greyscale).

 

[CheckerHater]

So far two guys who belive in "paperless" as much as I do.

But even myself I don't remenber when was the last time I faxed the drawing. E-mailing PDFs on the other hand...

More opinions please!

 

[MadMango]

The only "color standards" I have ever seen were things like red for corrections, yellow for corrected, blue for comments, etc. This was all back in the days of board drafting in architecture.

Wikipedia- " In AutoCAD usually parts to be printed in black are drawn in 1 to 7 basic colors. Color layer: Green-Center, Magenta-Measure of length and Blue-Hidden."

I have had to produce drawings in color to help production in assembly drawings, like full color PCB assemblies, or red for "important notes", but to all vendors I have only provided black and white drawings. I don't see an advantage with colors, as it makes everything else "unimportant" in the mind of whoever is looking at the drawing.

"I didn't read that because it wasn't printed in paisley."



"Art without engineering is dreaming; Engineering without art is calculating."


Have you read faq731-376 to make the best use of these Forums?

 

[btrueblood]

There is apparently a "standard" for CAD files, which AutoCad (2D) adheres to, that puts dimension text (i.e. ANSI Y14 symbols) into a yellow color that makes it unreadable on white background. Drives me nuts, as there is no way to change the color to black or any other dark color. It still plots ok in black and white...usually...

 

[CheckerHater]

Very well.

I’ve seen colors used for relatively innocent things like company logo, or to draw attention to CAD-created “approval stamp”, etc.

Also for separating “original” drawings created on plotter from “copies” created on copy machine. In this case mark or note was created saying something like “ORIGINAL WHEN RED”.

But I also saw it used to indicate things like “Critical dimensions”, which is getting too close to “Canned worms section” all by itself.

BTW, if anyone has actual copy of ANSI/ASME Y14.2 Line Conventions and Lettering, does it say anything about (NOT) using color?

 

[drawoh]

CheckerHater,

When my 2D drawings are sent out electronically, I assume the recipient has a crummy printer. I figure most machine shops have black and white 11x17" printers. Everyone else has 8.5x11" black and white ink jets. I prepare my drawings accordingly.

When I prepare my drawings for carpentry at home, I use colour. I think it looks better.

JHG

 

[drawoh]

CheckerHater,

There are two levels of colour here.

First, you can define layers, and use these to control colour and line thickness. At home, I like to make my object lines black, and my dimension lines and text, medium blue.

Secondly, you can set your SolidWorks views to shaded.

I have been using shaded views on preliminary drawings lately. If I have defined my outline as a transparent blob, this is the only way to communicate what I am doing. I have access to a colour printer. I can save JPEGS and create online notes in HTML.

When I have completed the design, I can, and usually do, convert everything back to conventional line drawings. If nothing else, current drafting standards are based on black and white line drawings.

If you are going to do colour layers and lines, you must set the background screen of your CAD program to white, or some reasonable facsimile of white. Yellow lines are very prominent on your black screen, and almost invisible on paper.

JHG

 

[ctopher]

As others wrote, it will eventually end up black, or grey-tones.
I once worked with a department that insisted their drawings be color. Once other departments started faxing, copying, scanning, whatever, the details were lost.

Chris
SolidWorks 10 SP5.0
ctopher's home
SolidWorks Legion

 

[Alonzohawk]

Point: One thing people forget is whether the light available out in the shop is enough to avoid confusion when you start playing with colors on a print. Blue, black, red, yellow and green lines, representing different values and details can easily be confused when the lighting is dim.

Point 2: If another designer has a different background color to improve contrast on his system, because the light on his station is different than yours, or if he is a little more blue/green colorblind then you are...

Point 3: Keeping three cartridges functional in your printer has just tripled your printing costs. Paperless is a nice concept. How many have made it work?

Point 4 (And this is selfish.): Ever try to get the military to shift gears or standards just because it improves engineering practice? There is some O-1 in an office at TACOM who is too dim to adjust away from the Book. Last month, I had to explain, (AGAIN) that a split lock washer depends on applying longitudinal loading, not digging in to the surfaces, to lock. They are still demanding hard copy files for storage in various contracts.

 

[drawoh]

Alonzohawk,

Given the complete lack of compatibility between different 3D CAD packages, or even versions of the same package, hard copies stored somewhere are a good idea.

When you select colours, you should select ones that contrast with the background. Hence, my remarks about having a white screen background, rather than a black one.

Some people are colour blind. Another case for drawings being readable in black and white.

JHG

 

[11echo]

One "golden rule" to follow:

- NEVER send dwg.s to any state or federal agent for permit that have been plotted in color!

 

[CheckerHater]

Thank you very much everybody!

Looks like I didn’t miss the memo and the colors didn’t make it to the mainstream yet.

11echo, thanks for very interesting note. I understand government requires black or blue ink when filling the forms. You made me realize that ALL the documents you submit are expected to be easy to scan / copy / fax, etc., so colors are probably out of the question when it comes to “official business”.

 

[KENAT]

Bit of a late tag on but we have a batch pdf printer with our CAD software, unfortunately it saves them as PDF's in color. When someone (internally or vendor) then plots them out in black and white but 'gray scaled' they are illegible in many situations.

So I always use a separate pdf printer/generator and the 'print all colors as black' option in CAD.

I've actually had vendors that got the colored version ask me for black & white.

The colors in the CAD actually make sense and help with use when creating the drawing, but when they go to using the drawing B&W still seems superior.

Posting guidelines faq731-376

http://eng-tips.com/market.cfm?

(probably not aimed specifically at you)
What is Engineering anyway: faq1088-1484​

 

[fcsuper]

I know there are people against it, but color in documents is here to stay, with gray scale being the alternative. As it becomes more common, people will get used to it and it will become part of the norm. At my last job, we had to make sure drawings printed good in gray scale. Baby steps.

Matt Lorono, CSWP
Product Definition Specialist, DS SolidWorks Corp
Personal sites:
Lorono's SolidWorks Resources & SolidWorks Legion

 

[btrueblood]

Drown that baby quick, before it grows up into the monster that eats drafters for lunch.

 

[fcsuper]

btrueblood, I think that has happened.

Matt Lorono, CSWP
Product Definition Specialist, DS SolidWorks Corp
Personal sites:
Lorono's SolidWorks Resources & SolidWorks Legion

 

[MadMango]

The more Marketing gets involved, the more colors you will see.

"Art without engineering is dreaming; Engineering without art is calculating."


Have you read faq731-376 to make the best use of these Forums?

 

[prdave00]

I fear the day marketing dictates practices for engineering drawings (unless it's the color of the logo in the title block).