Considering leaving structural engineering behind as a career. 8

[NorwegianEngineer]

Hello everyone,

I've worked in construction my entire life. 12 years as a carpenter before I graduated as a civil engineer and landed a job as a structural engineer which I've had for 7 years now. I work in a firm which mostly designs high rise buildings and my focus is on detailing the project (concrete design => 3D modeling => drawings to the manufacturer and construction site) with a focus on precast concrete.

I'm reaching a point where considering both my age and experience it's time to decide if I should really pursue this further and become an expert or if I should move on to something else.

What I dislike:

- Very competitive industry. It was okay until around 2022, but for the last few years it's been extremely competitive with everyone underbidding everyone else to get a project. In practice, this means that the projects are usually not earning money and we don't really have the time we need or want to do things properly. I get my salary regardless, but it's not a pleasant feeling when you know the project went red and the firm actually lost money on it. And your leader is always bugging you if you're finished soon and even implying you've spent way too much time on a design. When in truth it actually does take time.

The fact that it's so competitive means pressure on two fronts. Recently, there's been a lot of pressure from our customer to create optimized constructions (reduce material costs). So, we're pressured both on time to make it profitable for us and at the same time the customer is pressing us to make more optimized designs such that they can save money.

- Deadlines. The last few years have been OKAY, but I've had years working 500 + hours of overtime.

The deadlines and competitiveness also means there's not much time for learning new stuff on company time. I would literally need to spend my own free hours if I were to learn more about subjects I find interesting.

- Monotone work. The start of a project is usually fairly fun, but after the inital work is done it's often a repeat of the same theme across 100s or 1000s of element.

- Not as creative as I had hoped. I realize that other parts of the industry can be more creative, but detailing concrete blocks is fairly limited.

What I like? Well, overall I do like constructions and find the work interesting and have nice colleagues, but I feel the negatives mostly outweigh the positives currently.

I have friends who've been on projects where money isn't even an issue. Typically in the oil and gas sector or public projects. On the other hand, there's still deadlines, but it must be a good feeling to know you have an "unlimited" budget.

Would be great to hear from other structural engineers and how you feel about this career path. Maybe there's some positive and encouraging stories out there, too!

Best regards.

 

[ALK2415]

As an engineer with wooden construction expertise, you have a unique edge in the growing light weight/ wooden housing industry.
Combining structural and wooden construction which can help you start your own company apart from above listed pressure.

1-Innovate with Timber​

Use new timber technologies like cross-laminated timber (CLT) and laminated veneer lumber (LVL).
These materials offer strength and versatility, perfect for modern light-weight housing construction.

2-Hybrid Construction​

Integrate wood with steel, concrete, and glass for flexible and cost-effective designs (employing skilled Architect.)
This hybrid approach blends aesthetics with strength.

3- Collaboration​

Work with architects and Mechanical designers to meet both structural, aesthetic cost-effective solution that Market needs.
Explore emerging markets to widen your reach and build a diverse client base.

By leveraging your expertise, innovative materials, and sustainable practices, you can create a successful company in the lumber/wood industry.
and GOOD LUCK ...

 

[RattlinBog]

Have you considered working for an owner, sales, contractor, fabricator, etc. but still as structural engineer? Consulting can definitely be a grind. Maybe it would be refreshing to try structural from a different slice of the pie.

 

[Eng16080]

Having carpentry (construction) experience is a huge advantage as a structural engineer, or at least it is for me where most of my work is with wood. I would entertain starting you own company and not leaving the profession. I won't say it's easy, but you can eliminate a lot of the problems you mention working for yourself.

 

[NorwegianEngineer]

All great suggestions so far. Thank you!

A fitting analogy may be relationships. If you get into a bad relationship it doesn't mean every other woman is terrible and you should become a monk. Maybe I've just been in the wrong part of the industry so far.

To be clear, my experience so far as a consultant have been pretty good and it's not like it's all negative. But for the past few years I've had a lot of negative feelings creep up and I'm wondering if it's time for a change as the future in this job/role does not seem like much will ever change.

1. Working with wood

This is a great suggestion. I suppose it's a bit odd that I once was a very competent carpenter and haven't done a single project in wood as an engineer. I simply got a very good offer when I graduated starting out with a firm that specializes in high rise buildings and have been there ever since.

Recently, I actually interviewed with a firm who specializes on CLT and larger projects in wood here in Norway, but ultimately I declined because it seemed very similar to what I already do - except the components in my BIM software says it's a wooden element and not concrete. Meaning big projects, deadlines and the same kind of concerns I outlined in my original post. The job also had more responsibilities without a higher salary.

What kind of work do you do with wood, @Eng16080?

2. Starting my own company

In a way, that's the ultimate dream. Maybe I could simply be an independent consultant at some point. I will however honestly say that at this point I don't feel qualified enough to do so. I was proficient enough as a carpenter to do this, but as an engineer, I still feel there's too many holes in my knowledge bank to start something on my own at this point. Part of the reason for this is that I (we) work so specialized that I'm fairly good at a very small sub-set of structural design.

3. Working outside consulting

As suggested by @RattlinBog. Definitely something I should consider, too.

Thank you all.

PS: Would also be fun if you and other guys shared your actual thoughts/feelings about your career. Are you all loving it or have you had similar concerns like myself?

 

[Eng16080]

What kind of work do you do with wood, @Eng16080?

Mostly residential, as in single family homes. Some multi-family and some medium to large commercial. Most construction (here in the US) is with wood. Of course, having carpentry/construction experience is a benefit for all material types not just wood, because you start to think more about how you would actually construct something while you're designing it.

Would also be fun if you and other guys shared your actual thoughts/feelings about your career. Are you all loving it or have you had similar concerns like myself?

Working as an employee, I definitely had similar concerns. Working for myself, I'd say I'm generally loving it. I don't know if my situation is normal or not, but so far it's less stress and greater pay. I am working quite a bit though.

 

[member 1218881]

I am 29 years old and although I have completed my master's degree in structural engineering, I am considering studying for a medical doctor...

 

[human909]

2. Starting my own company

In a way, that's the ultimate dream. Maybe I could simply be an independent consultant at some point. I will however honestly say that at this point I don't feel qualified enough to do so. I was proficient enough as a carpenter to do this, but as an engineer, I still feel there's too many holes in my knowledge bank to start something on my own at this point. Part of the reason for this is that I (we) work so specialized that I'm fairly good at a very small sub-set of structural design.

If you were a proficient carpenter you are likely 80% of the way to being a fantastic residential engineer, presuming that you were doing residential. Going out on your own is scary. But you probably know more than you think and can quickly learn the rest, though given your specialized work maybe you do need a broader experience beforehand.

PS: Would also be fun if you and other guys shared your actual thoughts/feelings about your career. Are you all loving it or have you had similar concerns like myself?

I had a patchy career in other industries prior to retraining as an engineer. Long story of being young and naive and making the wrong study choices. That followed into a being a poor student barely passing my engineering degree....

After graduating I got a job at a mechanical design firm as I had the 3D modelling skills. There was not structural engineering done inhouse at the firm so I figured I'd move on after a few years. Work was varied and interesting but I wasn't satisfied with just 3D drafting. I started to push into structural design. I sought out an external third parties for peer reviewing but I largely had to teach myself everything. Continually working to learn more and a company that let my spread my wings eventually got me in a position where I was THE person in the company for any engineering questions.

I now have my own business that I work a couple days a week that is quite lucrative. I got a jump start from a retiring engineer which made the normal difficulty of obtaining clients much easier. I still work at my previous company part time, mostly out of loyalty but partly for security and colleagues.

There are still gaps in my knowledge. So there are many projects I won't take on. I've been doing some residential but I don't find that interesting, but it is important be able to practice in multiple areas. I'm working to fill other gaps but I'm also trying to expand my client base in my field of expertise as that is much more interesting for me.

 

[brye127]

Hello everyone,

I've worked in construction my entire life. 12 years as a carpenter before I graduated as a civil engineer and landed a job as a structural engineer which I've had for 7 years now. I work in a firm which mostly designs high rise buildings and my focus is on detailing the project (concrete design => 3D modeling => drawings to the manufacturer and construction site) with a focus on precast concrete.

I'm reaching a point where considering both my age and experience it's time to decide if I should really pursue this further and become an expert or if I should move on to something else.

What I dislike:

- Very competitive industry. It was okay until around 2022, but for the last few years it's been extremely competitive with everyone underbidding everyone else to get a project. In practice, this means that the projects are usually not earning money and we don't really have the time we need or want to do things properly. I get my salary regardless, but it's not a pleasant feeling when you know the project went red and the firm actually lost money on it. And your leader is always bugging you if you're finished soon and even implying you've spent way too much time on a design. When in truth it actually does take time.

The fact that it's so competitive means pressure on two fronts. Recently, there's been a lot of pressure from our customer to create optimized constructions (reduce material costs). So, we're pressured both on time to make it profitable for us and at the same time the customer is pressing us to make more optimized designs such that they can save money.

- Deadlines. The last few years have been OKAY, but I've had years working 500 + hours of overtime.

The deadlines and competitiveness also means there's not much time for learning new stuff on company time. I would literally need to spend my own free hours if I were to learn more about subjects I find interesting.

- Monotone work. The start of a project is usually fairly fun, but after the inital work is done it's often a repeat of the same theme across 100s or 1000s of element.

- Not as creative as I had hoped. I realize that other parts of the industry can be more creative, but detailing concrete blocks is fairly limited.

What I like? Well, overall I do like constructions and find the work interesting and have nice colleagues, but I feel the negatives mostly outweigh the positives currently.

I have friends who've been on projects where money isn't even an issue. Typically in the oil and gas sector or public projects. On the other hand, there's still deadlines, but it must be a good feeling to know you have an "unlimited" budget.

Would be great to hear from other structural engineers and how you feel about this career path. Maybe there's some positive and encouraging stories out there, too!

Best regards.

Maybe don't get out of the industry completely? Have you ever thought about bridges. I'm in the US, have about 5 years in bridges, and have had great satisfaction in the projects I've done. There are so many types of bridges, with so many types of materials, with so many types of components, it's really hard to get bored, which sounds like you are getting there. From prestreesed concrete to post-tensioned spliced girders, to steel plate girders, etc. From simply supported, to continuous, to spliced girders, cable stay, truss, etc. etc. No project is the same, and I've never gotten bored. Not sure how it is in Norway, but bridge engineering is a huge need in the States. Very hot market. It may be tough initially to get through the vertical to bridges gap, but it's all the same foundation. Good luck to you!

 

[JoshPlumSE]

NorwegianEngineer said:
PS: Would also be fun if you and other guys shared your actual thoughts/feelings about your career. Are you all loving it or have you had similar concerns like myself?

The first 6 years of my career were in the industrial sectors (steel equipment support structures, concrete foundations, etc). Working my way up to a lead engineer for small projects. That was fine. I was learning new skills steadily. Sometimes engineering skills, sometimes management skills. But, I felt (towards the end) that there was not going to me all that it might start to get kind of repetitive and less rewarding after awhile. I hadn't really reached that point yet. But, felt like it was close.

I changed directions and started working as a "non-traditional" structural engineer in the software industry for a company that did structural software. I had a number of friends that may similar changes around the same time. Some who became technical representatives for companies that made products for structural engineers. Anchors, connectors, proprietary moment connections (like side plate). When I look back on it, I feel like those of us that made this switch were the ones who wanted more "client interaction". Maybe we were the ones who felt that the endless cycle of analysis, calculations, drawings and deadlines lacked something that we needed.

I feel like that career pivot was pretty good for most of us. We still used a lot of our engineering knowledge, but did it in a way that was more suited to our personalities. I'm not bad mouthing the engineering profession at all. I know lots of engineers that love the day to day engineering work. That love seeing their projects get built, but can quickly move on to the next project at any time.

 

[NorwegianEngineer]

Thank you for all the wonderful replies and sorry for the late response. Another busy week in consulting.

Mostly residential, as in single family homes. Some multi-family and some medium to large commercial. Most construction (here in the US) is with wood. Of course, having carpentry/construction experience is a benefit for all material types not just wood, because you start to think more about how you would actually construct something while you're designing it.


Working as an employee, I definitely had similar concerns. Working for myself, I'd say I'm generally loving it. I don't know if my situation is normal or not, but so far it's less stress and greater pay. I am working quite a bit though.

Great. thanks. I don't mind working for sure. But I think what you do when working matters.

If you were a proficient carpenter you are likely 80% of the way to being a fantastic residential engineer, presuming that you were doing residential. Going out on your own is scary. But you probably know more than you think and can quickly learn the rest, though given your specialized work maybe you do need a broader experience beforehand.

I had a patchy career in other industries prior to retraining as an engineer. Long story of being young and naive and making the wrong study choices. That followed into a being a poor student barely passing my engineering degree....

After graduating I got a job at a mechanical design firm as I had the 3D modelling skills. There was not structural engineering done inhouse at the firm so I figured I'd move on after a few years. Work was varied and interesting but I wasn't satisfied with just 3D drafting. I started to push into structural design. I sought out an external third parties for peer reviewing but I largely had to teach myself everything. Continually working to learn more and a company that let my spread my wings eventually got me in a position where I was THE person in the company for any engineering questions.

I now have my own business that I work a couple days a week that is quite lucrative. I got a jump start from a retiring engineer which made the normal difficulty of obtaining clients much easier. I still work at my previous company part time, mostly out of loyalty but partly for security and colleagues.

There are still gaps in my knowledge. So there are many projects I won't take on. I've been doing some residential but I don't find that interesting, but it is important be able to practice in multiple areas. I'm working to fill other gaps but I'm also trying to expand my client base in my field of expertise as that is much more interesting for me.

Sounds great. Thanks.

Maybe don't get out of the industry completely? Have you ever thought about bridges. I'm in the US, have about 5 years in bridges, and have had great satisfaction in the projects I've done. There are so many types of bridges, with so many types of materials, with so many types of components, it's really hard to get bored, which sounds like you are getting there. From prestreesed concrete to post-tensioned spliced girders, to steel plate girders, etc. From simply supported, to continuous, to spliced girders, cable stay, truss, etc. etc. No project is the same, and I've never gotten bored. Not sure how it is in Norway, but bridge engineering is a huge need in the States. Very hot market. It may be tough initially to get through the vertical to bridges gap, but it's all the same foundation. Good luck to you!

Good suggestion. Thanks! Bridges is a big thing here in Norway, so I should not have any problems there. Also, most if not all bridges are contracted by the government, so project economy usually isn't an issue. I've had colleagues who worked with bridges and the budget is typically 'unlimited'. It's just a matter of getting the job done. There seem to often be quite tight deadlines, though.

The first 6 years of my career were in the industrial sectors (steel equipment support structures, concrete foundations, etc). Working my way up to a lead engineer for small projects. That was fine. I was learning new skills steadily. Sometimes engineering skills, sometimes management skills. But, I felt (towards the end) that there was not going to me all that it might start to get kind of repetitive and less rewarding after awhile. I hadn't really reached that point yet. But, felt like it was close.

I changed directions and started working as a "non-traditional" structural engineer in the software industry for a company that did structural software. I had a number of friends that may similar changes around the same time. Some who became technical representatives for companies that made products for structural engineers. Anchors, connectors, proprietary moment connections (like side plate). When I look back on it, I feel like those of us that made this switch were the ones who wanted more "client interaction". Maybe we were the ones who felt that the endless cycle of analysis, calculations, drawings and deadlines lacked something that we needed.

I feel like that career pivot was pretty good for most of us. We still used a lot of our engineering knowledge, but did it in a way that was more suited to our personalities. I'm not bad mouthing the engineering profession at all. I know lots of engineers that love the day to day engineering work. That love seeing their projects get built, but can quickly move on to the next project at any time.

Awesome. Definitely something to consider.

What you say about client interaction is interesting. I would say I'm a good mix between introvert and extrovert. I don't mind sitting with problems working on my own (which is what I do most of the time in this job), but I also love interacting with (new) people and I'm definitely missing that.

 

[NorwegianEngineer]

As a former carpenter I would also say I really miss being so little out in the field. I know this vary from firm to firm, but in my current job we're basically never at the site. Most of the projects I've participated in I've only seen photos off or cameras on the site.

 

[laneng]

I am currently a sole proprietor, but started out at a small firm. I was the 4th hire and the firm eventually grew to around 14-16 engineers at our peak. It allowed pretty much all of us to work on every kind of project - everything from single family homes, townhomes, existing rehabs, up to 15-20 story buildings. Sometimes the rehabs were just coming up with a new beam solution for someone who wanted to open up their kitchen, and sometimes it was gutting a 6 story industrial building and turning it into residential units.

I say this because if you are looking for a verity of projects, look for a small-ish company. Each engineer was basically given full projects, and we were able to do all the design and drawings ourselves. I don’t know if it’s like that at all small firms, but I also don’t know very many people who got that kind of experience right out of college.

I also found that there are tons of mid sized architectural firms that look for small SE firms because they know we can easily underbid most any large firm. There was still an amount of pressure to maintain the budget on a project, especially since you could always compare count your own hours to the design fee, but it was not nearly as cutthroat as what you are describing (again - tons of mid sized arch firms, at least where I am anyway).

After about 10 years there, I felt confident enough to go out on my own. The barrier to entry is almost nothing compared to other industries. Pretty much just a laptop, a few monitors, insurance & software (which are by far the two most expensive things, but still, way less than most other industries).

Anyway, I’m not sure what it’s like where you are, but that was my experience here in the Midwest US. I’m also sure most any small SE firm would love that you are a former carpenter. The vast majority of our work was residential, and there was always a few single family home renovations floating around the office, and I feel like I’ve always got at least one going now.

Best of luck and I hope it works out

 

[human909]

As a former carpenter I would also say I really miss being so little out in the field. I know this vary from firm to firm, but in my current job we're basically never at the site. Most of the projects I've participated in I've only seen photos off or cameras on the site.

That occurs FAR FAR too much for structural engineers and I think it is something that is true the world over for most consulting engineers. It is unfortunate as site time makes things much more interesting and significantly improves your engineering. If you can watch and particularly get feedback from the tradespeople doing the tasks you can learn so much in improving designs to perform better OR be easier to construct.

I am VERY lucky that I get plenty of site time (I mentioned my career details earlier). Salaried I work in design and build with 70% brownfield (existing structures). If I say I want to go to site then that is supported by the company. My own consultancy business I get decent site time in some areas as site inspections are required. Site visits to new builds would normally be at my expense but I still perform them if they are local. (getting that time on site is still important for learning, for me it is mostly residential as that is where I lack practical experience and the locations might be a short bicycle ride!)

The barrier to entry is almost nothing compared to other industries. Pretty much just a laptop, a few monitors, insurance & software (which are by far the two most expensive things, but still, way less than most other industries).

Quite true. Like most sole proprietor businesses it is still quite intimidating due to the uncertainty and the initial hurdles. Insurance rates probably vary significantly from locality to locality, but they are a decently high initial cost. But still compared to most small business start-ups the risks are far lower. (EG if I was going to be a Cafe owner or florist, the startup and ongoing risks are much higher.)

I was also particularly lucky as I had a ready made client base AND I managed to negotiate part time with my salaried job. (They weren't excited about me going out on my own, but they also knew they needed me.) Which removed the majority of the risk.