Construction to Structural Engineering - Career change Advice 1

[rpand4]

Hi Team

I have been a member on this forum for a little while now and actively spend time reading posts - bit of a lurker.

I could do with some career advice pretty please.

I am an engineer and I live in Queensland, Australia. I am in my early 30's and I graduated from University with first class honours in Civil Engineering in 2011. At university I took electives that were in the structural area of engineering. At uni I really enjoyed studying structural analysis and design and it is what attracted me the most to go an explore engineering more after graduating.

After graduating I always wanted to work in the structural engineering space however, the circumstances in Qld were a bit limiting at the time. The engineering sector was not favourable at all at the time with graduates who had jobs lined up, being laid off even before they started. There was evidently a lot of unemployment. A lot of my friends resorted to non technical jobs for a while before they could secure a job in the engineering industry.

My situation was a little different. At the start of my degree I secured a full time scholarship which paid for my degree and that was a blessing. However the deal was that my employer (Govt Sector) would require me to work for 4 years full time with them post graduation i.e. I had to repay them back in time (paid work). This scholarship was a big blessing in disguise because when I graduated I had a ready job waiting for me, unlike some of my friends.

The industry that I joined straight out of university was the construction industry. I never picked this, but rather was placed in this area as part of my graduate rotation program. My intention was only to stay in the construction field for 1 year and then to rotate to the structural engineering section of the govt sector. Within that first year, there was a change in Govt and the change lead to multiple other changes within the organisation which included the removal of the rotation program and downsizing the structural engineering branch to the point where they outsourced all the work to the private industry and essentially only administered the work.

This unfortunately didn't allow me to rotate to the area where I wanted to work, so I stayed back in civil construction for a bit longer. I didn't lose hope and after my first year and half in construction I started applying to small to mid size consulting firms in the hope I could lend an entry level position somewhere. The market was still cold and I didn't lend any interviews over the course of the next 6 months. Lol, I sent several hundred resumes out, most of which were tailor made, to the point I became good at writing resumes and started a side line hustle of writing resumes.

During my time in construction I learned a lot. I was a site engineer, a project engineer and I even moved up to a project manager in a span of 5 years. I worked on small to large construction projects - road construction, intersection upgrades, bridge rehabilitation, large drainage infrastructure projects, bridge jacking etc. I learned a lot. A part of me eventually stopped trying to secure a position elsewhere and carried on in the field I was in. However at the back of my mind I was still itching to go learn more and practice structural design.

However, the effort I had put in earlier on to apply for jobs didn't entirely go in vain. One company I applied to, to express my interest was a multinational firm that has a local branch. They had held on to my resume and kept it on file. In my 6th year of work, I got a call from them saying they have a position but it was in the maritime field and wanted to know if I would be interested. After discussing the details, they were looking to train someone up in the design space and manage future projects. In the hope to get a change of scenery and to practice design, I accepted the offer.

Things started off well and I realised that this is the space I wanted to be in (Design/Consulting). The whole experience resonated with me. However 6 months in to it the work picked up and my firm shifted me away from design and more so in to project managing larger projects which involved a lot more site work. This was primarily due to my background in construction and Project Management. I obliged and worked in that space and helped expand that area of the business. However I would regularly ask my manager to shift me back in the design space. The reality was I was far too valuable monetarily for them in the PM space and so shifting me was not much of an option for them. 2.5 years later, I started feeling that I had to move to another firm where I can get the experience I wanted.

6 months later I secured a job with a very small structural engineering firm which does some great challenging engineering projects. It started off really well but a few months in and COVID made an entry. The owners of the business, in a knee jerk reaction, downsized and let go of a few of their staff. I was one of them. Just about that time my old employer called me back asking if I would help them deliver a large construction project. I was out of work, so I agreed and jumped on board.

It's been two years and I have been back in the construction space. I still learn a lot daily and it pays me well too. However I am never technically challenged in this field. I never really use my core engineering technical knowledge extensively to problem solve. That very often eats at me and I still have a strong desire to get back in to design/consultancy.

To take things in to my hands, this year I enrolled in to a structural engineering refresher course (part time while I work). Something to help me resharpen my skills. However, I often get different questions come to my mind and I can't seem to work out how to go about with it all:

1) Is it too late for me to make a switch in to consultancy?

2) Most firms that advertise are looking for either graduates from uni or senior designers who have been practicing for a long time. I don't seem to fit the bill. How do I approach one of these firms?

3) Would a firm see my several years of construction experience as an advantage or my lack of design experience as a hinderance?

Anyway, I could really do with some honest advice especially from anyone who has been in a similar situation.

Thank you.

 

[phamENG]

1) It's never too late. But that doesn't mean it'll be easy, as you've discovered.

2) How much of a pay cut are you willing to take? You're going to be competing with new grads for those spots, and so you'll need to be willing to take new grad pay to get one. You can leverage your experience into convincing them that a) at that price point you stand way above the rest of the crowd or b) you at least earn one bump up in pay grade as you'll be ahead of them in your practical knowledge of construction. The tough part is convincing them that this is really what you want, and that taking a big pay cut isn't going to ruin you financially and send you running back to your old employer after your savings runs out in 3 months. This will probably be your toughest sell as you're not only asking them for a job, but also for them to invest in you and train you at a decent cost to them for the first couple of years. My mentor told me that when hiring an inexperienced engineer, no return on investment is realized in the first year, you're lucky to get one in the second year, and in the third you should start to be back in the black. (That's one of the reasons I can't bring myself to hire yet.) If you were in their shoes, what would you look for in a candidate to say "this one's going to stick around for a while"?

3) Both. They may want to put you into a construction contract administration department, working with contractors, reviewing shop drawings, managing RFIs, etc. - all the stuff engineers don't like to deal with because...contractors.

It sounds like you know what you want. I wish you the best of luck in making it happen.

 

[Ron247]

I am not familiar with the requirements in your geographical area but are you what we call a registered engineer in the states? Just being registered makes a big difference in competing with "fresh out of school".

Sell the value of the number of years of experience you have. There is a lot of value in several years of practice. Even people with an emphasis on structural in college do not graduate a functioning structural engineer. This includes advanced degrees. They still have a lot to learn once they graduate.

 

[Enable]

Question 1
Agree with PhamENG. It's never too late to explore things on this planet until you're in your grave. I'll give you an example: I know a full-blown college philosophy professor with tenure who is 60+ years old and is making the change to go to law school next year. He also fully intends to practice for a number of years to come. He's not rich or anything of the sort. He just wants to do it for personal growth, and so, he is.

If he can do that at 60 (going back to school then having to article in an unrelated field) you can surely jump into a very related field at 30ish.

Question 2
Never pay attention to what's in the recruitment flyer. HR puts that out because they have to list something but almost nothing listed will be impossible to overcome. You have a great amount of experience and if I was you, I wouldn't be dissuaded from applying at all.

Ideally you would approach via networking though. Meaning, try to latch on to some engineers rather than HR. You would be surprised how many people on linkedin would be willing to meet for a coffee to chat about their craft. People love to talk about their work for some strange reason (I suffer from the same disease). If you come across as genuine you'll get little resistance, and while the people you reach out to may not provide a job directly (dont go in thinking they will), they might know places looking for people and recommend you to them

Question 3
This will depend on the firm and the individual you talk to. For example, I come more from the construction side and I would hands down value contracting experience (assuming you actually learned how to build rather than watch things be built) over generic design experience. It's much easier to teach design (for the things I do anyways) than it is to get people how to think how to build.

But that's me. Definitely other shops will treat you as a dumb ass contractor and value your experience darn near negative. Which is okay. It just means you'll have to hunt around for the people that do appreciate it.

BTW I might suggest you look at some firms that do temporary works designs. Temp works are intimately related to constructability, and your experience there might be a huge benefit. And for you temp works is still design work! Could be a good fit

 

[ukengineer58]

I moved from construction into design at about 27/28. And I'd say it was a excellent choice for me. I did have to take a pay cut though - and was clear I was fine with that at interview.
I think on site constrcution experience is a valuable skill to bring to design, however some people I have seen do it have struggled with the techncial aspects. On the plus side as you move up the design ladder and your more out of number crunching understanding how things are built will give you a advantage in managign design teams.
Financially you maybe need to consider how long it will take you to 'catch up' your career to where you were. In the UK the consultant pay can vary widely between large and small firms and types of projects. But you may be more likely to progress quickly at something you love.
But maybe like you, i find design much more interesting, espeocailly as you gain experience and work more independently. and its dryer in the winter...its feels more like problem solving than firefighting on site. And there is always something new to learn technically.
Dont think there is a reason it cant be done, as long as you are willing to put the effort in to learn the technical aspects, and are willing to accept the loss of money in the short term. Your experiece will certainly be a help not a hindrance in your design career, providing you can accept those 2 points then it will be a huge advantage over grads as long as you can convince an interviewer that you will out the effort in and pay isnt a issue.

 

[rowingengineer]

1. Your only 30, you have years and years ahead of you

2. There aren't as many grads this coming due to the changes in the school system a number of years ago to go from are at 1 jan to o agr at 31 June for classes. If your willing to work away from Brisbane there will be many opportunities.

3. Depends, you would need to sell this, for me I call looking with eyes open. If you're looking at the jobs taking in the info as you direct the build then often this means you exp is helpful. If your a program guy this isn't so much.

If you want send me an email I can point you to a few places that are desperate for people. My username@live.com.au

 

[IRstuff]

2) Most firms that advertise are looking for either graduates from uni or senior designers who have been practicing for a long time. I don't seem to fit the bill. How do I approach one of these firms?

My take on requirements in job postings is that they're there for rejecting you if they don't like you. The converse is that you need to convince them that YOU are THE solution to their problem(s). If they're convinced you are THE ONE, they'll ignore what they thought they wanted in the job posting.

3) Would a firm see my several years of construction experience as an advantage or my lack of design experience as a hinderance?

Yes, and yes, BUT, YOU are THE solution to their problems, because you bring years of construction experience to bear on design problems, etc.

TTFN (ta ta for now)
I can do absolutely anything. I'm an expert!

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[rpand4]

You are not wrong about the pay cut. It's something that I will have to accept. I have experienced this in the past when I left construction to join a private consultancy - I took a large pay cut. I was happy to do so with the intention of furthering my knowledge and skill set in engineering.

Thank you for you encouragement. It means a lot to me.

 

[rpand4]

In Queensland we have what is called RPEQ, which stands for Registered Professional Engineer Queensland. Registration as a RPEQ is formal recognition of the qualification and competency of an engineer in the State of Queensland. Like other professions such as builders and architects, engineers in Queensland have a registration scheme that certifies and protects the title of “Professional Engineer”

You make a good point that being registered would give me some leverage over the others. This is something I didn't really consider. I could use this to my advantage to show experience post graduation. Thank you for this!

 

[rpand4]

I cannot thank you all for your encouraging words of wisdom. It has really encouraged me to look in to this further with great enthusiasm. I will actively work to make this happen for me. Thank you very much again for your kind words.