Correct pronunciation of "Pilaster" 4

[SRO]

I won't bore everyone with the pointless story of how this came up but someone told me I was pronouncing pilaster incorrectly today. I've only ever heard it pronounced one way and that is "PIE-LASTER" she was telling me that another engineer "corrected" her when she pronounced it this way and told her the proper way to pronounce it is "PILL-ISTER". Has anyone ever heard it pronounced this way?

 

[DaveAtkins]

It is pronounced "embedded column"

Or should that be embedded colyum

DaveAtkins

 

[JStephen]

The "correct" pronunciation for any word is how it's commonly pronounced, regardless of its origin or derivation. And that pronunciation can vary regionally as well.

 

[BridgeSmith]

"Does anyone call a 'PILL-AR' at 'PIE-LAR' "

I know a few guys from western Kentucky that do...

 

[BridgeSmith]

"the gubmint website backs him up"

Yeah, because the gubmint is always right...

Anyway, fel3's quote from that same gubmint webpage hints at (but then contradicts) the assertion: "Township 7 North, Range 2 West, which would mean that it was in the 7th tier of townships north of a baseline...". In their example T7N is Tier 7 North, but apparently even the writer for the USGS doesn't know any better, like the 20-year licensed land surveyor I worked with.

Link

Link

Link

 

[cliff234]

I vote for "pie-laster".

On a related note I've noticed that some people pronounce "masonry" as "masonary". In fact I once saw a masonry contractor's truck with his company name beautifully painted on the door, "Joe's Masonary Construction". That's almost as bad as a spelling error on a tattoo.

 

[JStephen]

Maybe he was a masonary contractor at the nucular plant, building masonary pilaster colyums.

 

[JLNJ]

Colyums? You mean those vertical beams?

 

[PEinc]

Various dictionaries show a selection of pronunciations. The Merriam-Webster dictionary on my IPad says the word as pi-LAS'-ter with a short "I" in the first syllable. I always pronounced it pie'-laster. Generally, when a vowel is followed by a consonant and then another vowel, the vowel is a long vowel. Therefore, pie-laster, but pick which syllable is accented. Think bay-gel, not baggel.

http://www.PeirceEngineering.com

 

[fel3]

HotRod10…

From Surveying, Sixth Edition, Moffit and Brouchard, 1975, Section 17-12, Numbering Townships (p. 723):

"The townships of a survey district are numbered meridionally into ranges and latitudinally into tiers with respect to the principal meridian and the baseline of the district. As illustated in Fig. 17-4, the third township south of the baseline is in tier 3 south. Instead of tier, the word township is more frequently used; thus any township in this particular tier is designated as "township 3 south."​

I graduated college in 1980 and have been a licensed civil engineer in California since 1983. I have worked with dozens of licensed surveyors, some with longer careers than me. I have worked with hundreds of legal descrptions and exhibit maps, along with parcel maps, tract maps, etc. I have even written a few dozen legal descriptions myself. Over my long career, I have never heard a civil engineer or surveyor use the word tier in this context, only township. And, every time I have seen tier spelled out in a legal description or on a legal map, it has been spelled township.

Table 3-2 in the BLM's Manual of Surveying Instructions (2009) indicates numbering by township and range, not by tier and range. This document does use tier as you do, but uses township more often (e.g. Appendix I, Specimen Field Notes).

From your third link: "Township - In the U.S. public land surveying system, an area six miles square, containing 36 sections. The townships are organized in tiers and ranges, identified with respect to a baseline and meridian. For example, Township 13 North Range 6 West describes a township's location."

The point of all this is that both township and tier are perfectly acceptable in this context, with township being more commonly used.

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"Is it the only lesson of history that mankind is unteachable?"
--Winston S. Churchill

 

[StrucDesignPE]

I say pie-laster as well.

It derives from the word 'Pillar'. Does anyone call a 'PILL-AR' at 'PIE-LAR'

Columns (pillars) embedded in the ground are called piles, not pills. Pile is derived from the French word for pillar.

 

[BridgeSmith]

"The point of all this is that both township and tier are perfectly acceptable in this context, with township being more commonly used."

"Township" is obviously accepted vernacular, and used almost exclusively, but I maintain it is not the correct term for a row of townships.

 

[epoxybot]

If we adhere to the origin of the word, then it is pee-laster. There isn't a long "I" (eye) in Italian. All those wise guts from Long Island & New Jersey claiming to be Eye-talian are saying it wrong. Hey, not that there is anything wrong with that. Years ago I worked with a guy from New Jersey who winced whenever I said Con-doo-it instead of Con-dout. See-ment vs Suh-ment. At least we can all agree on Moose-milk, Monkey Blood, Catheads & She-Bolts...

 

[bridgebuster]

In NYC it's "bay-gul"[pre][/pre]

 

[Compositepro]

I've mainly heard pie-laster but it seems most dictionaries prefer pill-aster. Another "rule" in English is that a vowel followed by one consonant and a vowel is pronounced long, while a vowel followed by two consonants and a vowel is pronounced short. Pillar has two consonants after the "i", so no one would argue that it should be pronounced long. so take your pick as to which rule to violate.

 

[fel3]

HotRod10…

If the official instructions for public land surveying (from the BLM) uses township interchangeably with tier (and more often), then the two are synonyms. The oldest survey documents I have used date to the early 1860s and at least one spelled out township, so township can't be considered just vernacular. It is an accepted term on par with (but more favored) than tier.

==========
"Is it the only lesson of history that mankind is unteachable?"
--Winston S. Churchill

 

[BridgeSmith]

fel3, the BLM doesn't dictate the rules for land surveys. Looking at it further, it appears that using "township" may be a long-standing abbreviated form of "township tier", as in a tier of townships. Legal Descriptions

 

[msquared48]

Pi'-lass-ter

Mike McCann, PE, SE (WA)

 

[fel3]

HotRod10…

Actually, the BLM does dictate the rules and procedures for the Public Land Survey System. From

https://nationalmap.gov/small_scale/a_plss.html:

"The Public Land Survey System (PLSS) is a way of subdividing and describing land in the United States. All lands in the public domain are subject to subdivision by this rectangular system of surveys, which is regulated by the U.S. Department of the Interior, Bureau of Land Management (BLM)."​

Thus, the terminology used by the BLM is the official terminology. So, if BLM uses township for tier (and they do), then these two terms are, by definition for this context, synonyms. Township is not a denigrated term.

Two of your links are real estate sites and one is for geology, none of which should be considered a primary source for information and terminology for the PLSS. Your other link, and the only one directly related to surveying, supports the use of township for tier, as I pointed out above.

Fred

==========
"Is it the only lesson of history that mankind is unteachable?"
--Winston S. Churchill

 

[canwesteng]

I'm gonna keep saying pie-laster. Could be worse, I've heard masonry pronounced masonary, and euler called ooler.

 

[JStephen]

I was just watching this video, presumably narrated by a non-engineer:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z_vIj2maqrQ

And I hear about "guh-SET plates" at about 1:46 (Reminds me of Mrs. Bucket saying "It's pronounced "boo-kay, it's French!")
And about "Cuh-say-zhuns" (Caissons) at 6:45.
Guh-SET at least rhymes with cassette and is phonetic, I don't know where the cuh-say-zhuns comes from.