Definition of the test blocks casting integrally on the castings

[mrmalcolm]

In ISO4990-2023,the test blocks may be cast separately, attached to the castings or cast integrally on the castings.
In ASTM A781, test coupons may be cast integrally with the castings, or as separate blocks.
How to understand the test blocks casting integrally on the castings? Does Cast integrally on the castings means specimens cut and machined from the production casting itself?If not, how do you define the test blocks casting integrally on the castings?

Your early reply will be highly appreciated.
Best Regards,

malcolm

 

[SJones]

Example for ASTM A216 WCB from IOGP S-563:

Steve Jones
Corrosion Management Consultant

http://www.linkedin.com/in/drstevejones

All answers are personal opinions only and are in no way connected with any employer.

 

[MagBen]

It really depends on materials, the casting dimensions and what testing to run, etc., but basically you will need to design a gating system to cast a block to represent the properties of the castings, or the worse portion of the casting (as the thickest wall in the example @SJones offered). the key is you can convince your clients that the block is representative if there is not a standard existed.

 

[mrmalcolm]

Thank you.
According to ASTM A781 and ASTM A216, integrated test blocks are understood as test blocks attached to castings,which is heat treated together with the casting body.In ASTM A781 and ASTM A216, integrated test blocks are not cut and machined from the production casting itself.
However, in ISO4990-2023,the test blocks may be cast separately, attached to the castings or cast integrally on the castings.Integrated test blocks are cut and machined from the production casting itself.
I don't know if we understand correctly.

 

[MagBen]

I see no conflicts. Do whatever you want with a good reason, unless my customer requests one way over another.

 

[mrmalcolm]

Thank you.The manufacturer and the purchaser have different understandings of the definition of "cast integrally on the castings".
According to the agreement between the manufacturer and the purchaser, the test blocks shall be cast integrally on the castings according to ISO 4990.
However, the manufacturer believes that cast integrally on the castings means specimens cut and machined from the production casting itself in ISO 4990.
Manufacturer has a different viewpoint, which argues that cast integrally on the castings means test blocks attached directly to the casting, which cast from the same ladle of the casting products and been heat-treated with the casting products in ISO 4990.
What is the correct understanding or other understanding for the ISO 4990 standard?

 

[SJones]

Is the manufacturer going to make the casting as per the sketch 5 posts up? Technically, if they machine from the integrated test block that would be considered machining from a production casting. What does their drawing show?


Steve Jones
Corrosion Management Consultant

http://www.linkedin.com/in/drstevejones

All answers are personal opinions only and are in no way connected with any employer.

 

[mrmalcolm]

Thank you. In the agreement between the manufacturer and the purchaser, there is no diagram of the test block, but it is stipulated that the test block is cast separately according to ISO 4990. Therefore, the manufacturer and the purchaser have different understandings. However, the definition for cast separately according to ISO 4990 is not found.
Therefore, seeking your understanding and definition for cast separately according to ISO 4990.
Best Regards

 

[EdStainless]

If the purchaser wants test blocks machined from actual production castings, then that is what they need to say.
Don't rely on specifications with wording that you don't control.
I have even seen drawings specifying where the test pieces were to be cut from on a part.
A test block cast as an extension of a production part using same gate and riser system and poured at the same time meets all of the requirements of being integral.
As long as the dimensions of the test block are representative of the actual part dimensions and remain attached during any subsequent heat treatment, I don't see any discussion.

= = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =
P.E. Metallurgy, consulting work welcomed