Distance between U/G pipeline and train tracks

[ifran31]

Good morning,

I have a pipeline 12'' diameter crosses the train tracks, my questions are as follows:

1) What is the distance between the train tracks and U/G pipeline diameter 12''?

2) Can I use a distance d = 1x External diameter (i.e. d. 12’’)?

3) Is that the code specifies this distance?

Thank you in advance for your answers.

R.B (Mechanical Engineer)

 

[austsa]

Depth of cover (distance between top of pipe and ground surface) under roads is generally about 1000mm. Under rail tracks, generally about 2000mm (depends on national/local code and/or rail authorities). 12" under rail is definitely not enough.

 

[DSB123]

There is an API Code which gives this sort of information. As austsa mentions the depth under train tracks is normally around 2m. There are calculation methods in the API Code. Just cannot remember it's number at present.

 

[SectionIX]

Plus you may want to consider casing the pipeline as well. Depending on your code of construction and regulator conditions, your design factor and other considerations could be affected as well, i.e., 49CFR Part 192.111, 49CFR Part 192.343,etc...

 

[zdas04]

The regulation that SectionIX mentioned is the authorizing regulation for the U.S. Department of Transportation (DOT). That reg basically (but not explicitly) requires casing any line going under a railroad track. They also have language that requires you to review your plans with the owner of the rail line. I've found that to be a bigger pain than the casing.

David Simpson, PE
MuleShoe Engineering

"Belief" is the acceptance of an hypotheses in the absence of data.
"Prejudice" is having an opinion not supported by the preponderance of the data.
"Knowledge" is only found through the accumulation and analysis of data.

 

[BigInch]

API 1102, Steel Pipelines Crossing Railroads and HighwaysMINIMUM is 1.8 m (6 ft) clear from bottom of rail to top of pipe. That must be of course increased when stresses at 1.8 m clear are calculated to be greater than allowables.

In future please state which dimension you are asking about, vertical, or horizontal distance. "Distance" used alone has more use for indicating horizontal dimensions, where height, or clear height, for vertical dimension, or better yet, post a diagram.

"People will work for you with blood and sweat and tears if they work for what they believe in......" - Simon Sinek

 

[jgailla]

Note zdas' answer. The railroad company will be who decides, and their minimums are often greater than code minimums.

 

[BigInch]

Very true. API 1102 is only a minimum clear depth. The trick is that you must get a signed permit from the RR company to make the crossing, so they will have the final say-so... in just about everything, clear depth, crossing angle, casing, length of casing, minimum casing wall thickness, grade, type of material, the whole 9 yds. Even if there are no tracks.

"People will work for you with blood and sweat and tears if they work for what they believe in......" - Simon Sinek

 

[zdas04]

AND the the only guy that can sign the form gets 50 weeks of vacation a year and has trouble working in his holidays.

David Simpson, PE
MuleShoe Engineering

"Belief" is the acceptance of an hypotheses in the absence of data.
"Prejudice" is having an opinion not supported by the preponderance of the data.
"Knowledge" is only found through the accumulation and analysis of data.

 

[stanier]

The other matter you may need to consider is electrical grounding and isolation. Stray currents cause corrosion of steel and iron pipes. induced currents may be hazardous to workers.

“The beautiful thing about learning is that no one can take it away from you.”
---B.B. King

http://waterhammer.hopout.com.au/

 

[ifran31]

Good morning guys and thanks for your answers,

The project consists of design of a pipeline 12'' diameter to a ship loading installation (crude oil). This pipeline goes under a railway (the train carries usually oil citterns), for 3 m distance. This pipeline is located inside an industrial area.
Please note the pipe is installed horizontally with respect to ground level.

Is that the catholic protection is required for the small portion (3 m) of the pipe?

Thank you in advance
(Sorry for my English, I am a beginner)
R.B (Mechanical engineer)

 

[zdas04]

The decision to apply cathodic protection to a line or not generally applies to the entire line, not just to a crossing. Casings do increase the risk of creating a cathodic cell, but that risk can be mitigated by using sacrificial anodes on the casing itself if you didn't have plans to apply an induced current on the entire line.

David Simpson, PE
MuleShoe Engineering

"Belief" is the acceptance of an hypotheses in the absence of data.
"Prejudice" is having an opinion not supported by the preponderance of the data.
"Knowledge" is only found through the accumulation and analysis of data.

 

[ifran31]

Good morning,

Zdas04,
Thanks for your help and have a nice day,

"Small actions can make a big difference"

R.B (Mechanical engineer)

 

[bimr]

All of the railroads have real estate departments that approve the installation of utilities under the railroad. Here are examples:

http://www.uprr.com/reus/attachments/pipeline/dr0404a.pdf

http://www.uprr.com/reus/pipeline/procedur.shtml

The railroad will also charge a fee for the crossing.

Stray currents and cathodic protection are two different things. Stray currents are typically mentioned as possible problems by persons who lack knowledgeable about electrical systems.

 

[rconner]

With regard to ifran's (really unnecessary) apology for non-native English, I wonder when Microsoft will finally add the quite proper term "cathodic" to their dictionary, and thereby avoid the auto-correct to other? I guess it might eventually take a personal plea from the Pope, as I understand Catholics don't use "protection" (everyone have a good weekend ;>))

 

[konman]

In Canada, it is typically the railway that has the last say. Check out

http://www.tc.gc.ca/eng/railsafety/standards-tce10-236.htm

for starters.

Too long didn't read? - 10 ft minimum for uncased crossings

 

[BigInch]

At least there you have an uncased option, however unreasonable it is.

"People will work for you with blood and sweat and tears if they work for what they believe in......" - Simon Sinek

 

[ifran31]

Good morning everybody,

Thank you for clarify my concern,

1)Bimr and Konman

In my case the railway is within an industrial area not for public services. The preliminary technical file is only approved by organization technical control.

For your information the pipe is completely underground and purchased with coating, the catholic protection, I speak only for the small section that crosses the railway.

Thank you for the links you have attached.

Konman
I do not understand your question; you speak of 10’’ diameter for the jacket? If this is the case, the diameter of the pipe is 12''?????? Your opinion please.

2)Rconner
Really, I find it difficult to improve my English because my mother language is French. I know that English is an international language and it is very useful in the industry. My questions and my answers are always written in French and then translated into English are through Google translation.

Thank you for the advice.

3)BigInch

Yes uncased option does not exist for underground piping to the passage of road and railway.

Thank you for your message.

Time is money, thank you again and good day

greetings
R.B (Menchanical engineer)