Dual Engineering and Architectural Licenses?

[2jdevine]

This is primarily a post for the few of you who have dual licenses in civil/structural engineering and architecture.
A little background first. I have my BS in architectural engineering and have several years of experience working in structural engineering firms. I am currently applying to take the PE in the spring. During the process I have begun to think about what "the next step" in my career should be. I have contemplated returning to school for an M.arch degree with the end goal of attaining my architectural license.
I quite enjoyed all my architecture classes as an undergrad (probably more then my engineering classes) and actually took several additional labs than that required. So the time to get my M.arch degree should be minimized. All that being said, I know this would be a lengthy and costly endeavor.

My questions would be: Did you have to take a large cut in salary when you began your work experience under an architect? How marketable is having both licenses? And ultimately did all the work pay off?

Also if you have any tips for along the way, I am all ears.

 

[JAE]

I've known a couple of people who have dual licenses (structural and architectural). Generally they ended up actually being better experienced in structural engineering. One was a structural engineer in an A/E firm and the other worked for a large government agency overseeing projects - more project management from the owner's perspective rather than being deeply involved in actual design work.

I'm not sure whether you can successfully develop as an engineer and an architect simultaneously. Seems like you would always gravitate to one or the other - or become a person with wider knowledge vs. deeper experience in one specific field.

 

[kylesito]

Does anyone else hear George Costanza shouting about world's colliding?

I agree with JAE, I know a few who have gone this route but they almost all end up more on the engineering side. I did have one person tell me once that they felt it actually limited their possibilities. Some of the architects who would have normally partnered with his company were reluctant once he got his Arch license because he was now a competitor, not just a colleague. I don't know if his experience is typical or not.


PE, SE
Eastern United States

"If a builder builds a house for someone, and does not construct it properly, and the house which he built falls in and kills its owner, then that builder shall be put to death!"
~Code of Hammurabi

 

[casseopeia]

I came within 30 hours of completing an engineering degree after being a licensed architect for awhile. I dropped out after an illness and decided I didn't want to spend any more time in school. I have never really been in the design world. I've mostly been in Construction Administration and Litigation for construction accidents and defects. You would be doing the opposite, engineer then architect. To qualify for the architectural exam, you have to work under a licensed architect and gain experience in various phases such as programming, design development, construction documents, code review, sustainable design, etc. You could probably do that while also doing engineering work at the right place of employment. You need to look at working for a full service firm that has plenty of arch and eng work. It's up to you to negotiate a reasonable salary based on your value to the firm.

"Gorgeous hair is the best revenge." Ivana Trump

 

[Forensic74]

At my previous Arch/Eng firm I was astonished at how little the architects my age made compared to me.

 

[fel3]

I know two people who have degrees in both civil and architectural and are licensed in both disciplines. I know, I need to get out more.

The older one (about my age) has, IIRC, bachelors and masters in civil and bachelors in architectural. He practices civil engineering, primarily wastewater treatment. He is brilliant and accomplished, but he's also a jerk and fortunately I am no longer associated with him. I know several people who have met and/or subconsulted for him and they didn't like him either, so it's not just me.

The younger one (mid 30s) has dual bachelors degrees. He practices architecture but is also responsible for interfacing with the project civil. I had the pleasure to work with him and the architectural firm that employed him on several projects.

The older one certainly made more money, but the younger on was worth more IMHO.

I know several architects personally and many more professionally. As I understand it, starting architects make less than starting engineers, but at some point it becomes comparable.

==========
"Is it the only lesson of history that mankind is unteachable?"
--Winston S. Churchill

 

[Ron]

Would be good if you intend to hang out your own shingle at some point. I have only known one over the years...very successful practice combining both, specializing in large, tilt-up concrete office/warehouses in upscale commercial parks.

 

[2jdevine]

Thanks for all the input.
I would agree with you JAE, it would be difficult the develop depth of knowledge in a field as encompassing as architecture. I usually think of Architects as generalists and engineers as specialists.
That being said, I would assume I would gravitate towards architecture but still be able to lay out a structural system that makes sense. In my experience most of the architects I‘ve dealt with have no clue when it comes to the structure, often asking for ridiculous solutions. I believe a fundamental aspect to being an architect should include knowing what a reasonable structure includes.
I guess this all leads to Ron’s point, I think it would eventually lead me to starting my own A/E firm or at least becoming a partner in one.