Fire (booster) pump for standpipe

[ForeverStudent]

Hi Everybody,

I am in New York, and the code requires for standpipes to provide 70 psi at the most remote connection. The pressure at street level is 55 psi. I did hydraulic calculation and it is adequate for sprinkler demand, it is going to be combined system. Does it mean, that in any case when we have standpipe, the fire (booster) pump required, or that pressure requirement implies the usage of fire pumper?

Thank you

 

[TravisMack]

Manual or Automatic standpipe? Big difference. Manual standpipe, the pump is the fire truck. Automatic standpipe, pump must be on site.

Travis Mack
MFP Design, LLC

http://www.mfpdesign.com

 

[ForeverStudent]

Hi Travis, thank you very much for the response. I thought that in most cases automatic standpipe is required and other types installed only in special situations. Am I wrong?

 

[TravisMack]

Depends on what your local building code states. Per NFPA 14, manual standpipes shall not be installed in high rises. Therefore, if you are under NFPA 14 and not over ridden by a bldg code, NFPA 14 allows manual standpipes in a "mid-rise" building.

There are manual wet and manual dry standpipes. Manual dry are only allowed in areas subject to freezing and with approval of the AHJ. At least, that is what I recall without looking it up right now.

Travis Mack
MFP Design, LLC

http://www.mfpdesign.com

 

[ForeverStudent]

Travis, as usual you give concise answers, thanks a lot! So as far as I understand in case of wet manual standpipe I do not care about pressure, is this correct? (logically should analyze available water flow though).

 

[Jondoeiowa]

ForeverStudent,

This may not be your answer but it could lead you to it. In a similar situation here on a building I had to do the calcs with the water source being the local Fire Depts pumper truck, to prove that when they brought the truck up to the building and connected that the standpipe would indeed provide the required flow at the top with this truck connect. Then the AHJ required us to put a placard above the FDC stating "Manual Wet Standpipe" to make sure the crew understood to connect the pumper truck. (No offense to our men in black and yellow but a AHJ I spoke with stated they hook up the hoses to the FDC only about 10% of the time.)

Correct me if I'm totally off base Travis but just what happened here.

Thanks,
Jon

 

[TravisMack]

No, you still calculate the standpipe. But, you typically use the FDC inlet as your water supply. Check with the AHJ, but it is likely they will be able to provide 150 psi at 1000 gpm for your use at the FDC inlet. As long as you can use that pressure and calc your system to work, then you are good.



Travis Mack
MFP Design, LLC

http://www.mfpdesign.com

 

[ForeverStudent]

Thank you everybody for the valuable input. By the way, as Jomdoeiowa described, what about acceptance test? Does it mean that in this situation it is necessary to physically bring fire truck to conduct the test (with corresponding charges to the client)?

 

[TravisMack]

Yes, that is exactly what it means. I have heard some FD's do this as a courtesy. Others charge for use of the equipment. But, the building owner can either pay to have an onsite pump installed and maintained, or they can pay to have the fire truck show up for testing. Which do you think is less costly?

Travis Mack
MFP Design, LLC

http://www.mfpdesign.com

 

[Jondoeiowa]

We had the Fire Dept. bring the truck to the site and test the standpipes, they did charge us but the building owner covered this cost.

I've attached a shot of the building we had this situation on just for reference.

Thanks,
Jon

 

[cdafd]

JON
that building did not require a fire pump at all?????

 

[ForeverStudent]

Hi cdafd,

You are correct, normally such a building (residential 6 stories) does not require standpipe, but mine is special case, because of location (narrow street) New York City BSA mandated to install the standpipe.

 

[Jondoeiowa]

CDAFD,

There are two buildings in the shot, the nearly complete building to the left of the shot had a 1500 GPM, 120 PSI Variable Frequency Drive pump we installed. The building to the right they chose not to connect to the fire-pump and it was a semi-heated parking garage 11 stories high. This was the building we had to provide the calcs for the pumper truck as the water supply. The city supply was not enough to provide 100 gpm at the most remote valve.

Thanks,
Jon

 

[Jondoeiowa]

Here is a shot from Google maps of the completed site.

http://maps.google.com/maps?q=wellm...oines,+ia&cid=0,0,442290524742706411&t=h&z=19